z80

Nephews pintara with CA20e engine just stops, and restarts perfectly.

Any clues?

I am suspecting the cylinder head temp sensor, but curious if anyone else has encountered the symptoms....it looks like a cow to change it...

Godzilla

Geez Zed thats a hard one to pinpoint while sitting behind a pc.

Ok some basics.

Id look at the ignition system.

If its got a distributor there should be an ignition module inside (like electronic ignition) that could start playing games or a wheel with cutouts inside the dizzy that run through a sensor which can get dirt inside or cause intermittant problems.

If it doesnt have a dizzy it will have a crank angle sensor either a sensor running near the crank or a unit hanging off the cam that works like a dizzys sensor.

Check your wiring plugs (connections).

Does it run an airflow meter (a box near the aircleaner with a plug in it)?
Check the connection, nissans are known to get dry solder joints inside the unit which can be cut open and repaired.
Also if the AFM is removed its good to clean it inside where the probe is with contact cleaner. It helps it get better airflow readings.

best4less

Does the engine just dead stop(electrical) or splatter a bit (fuel)

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Mods

OK, I'm going to try to remain calm when retelling this story, and I'll use as little bad language as is possible.
I had a pintara wagon a few years ago which had the same symptons that you have. I'll run you through my diagnosis.
Firstly though what happened initially is that you would drive along and it was like somebody just turned the key off - then it would just start up straight away. I could live with this. However it happened more frequently, and in worse places, and took longer to start - until the fateful day whwn she wouldn't go at all. I ended up buying a new car and towing it home.
When it first happened I knew it was electrical, and suspected the ignition, but didn't know where to go after that. So I took it to the mechanic, and after replacing some injectors (loose wires), and some other non related stuff they gave it back to me saying they couldn't repkicate the problems.
I only got about 200 metres and it did it again. So the next day I replaced the whole distributor - including the crank angle sensor which I suspected - once again to no avail.
This is when I took it to an auto electrician and left it there for two weeks ! They couldn't find a problem with it, but I didn't want it back until they did - finally while driving it around the front to give it back to me it went Joy I thought. The replaced the ECU and the fuel pump. Needless to say this wasn't it either.
I replaced fuses, all the relays, battery, both ignition coils, leads - and it still did it.
The last time it did it to me I towed it home and after a few weeks replaced a brand new fuel pump with one from the wreckers and it fired up. I sold it as soon as I could. I told the bloke about the problems,and showed him the receipts, and he still bought it. I caught up with him about 8 months later, he drove it up to Darwin and drove it around for a few days and then it did the same thing to him. The auto electrician up there couldn't fix it, so the last I heard he was going to literally blow it up in the middle of his property.
Good luck

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Godzilla

This is the AFM (also known as MAF=mass airflow sensor), if you cut into the silicon on the square top you will expose the internal connections.



Some cars without distributors have crank angle sensors, a probe next to the harmonic balancer, or a sensor running off the camshaft like here.



If it does have a distributor it will have a electronic module, sometimes external like in this pic (an old ford one) or internal, possibly a small back box.



Electronic distribtors have a air gap sensor (cant remember the correct electronic term) like in the back of a sat system positioner that can get dirty or intermidantly fail.


Water temp sensors are very reliable, but oxygen sensors are not.
Take note of that if the car smells "rich" in fumes.

intelliGEORGE

Sounds like the fuel pump. I had a similar problem with my VS commodore.

In my case it was heat build up in the tank which caused the fuel to boil, this results in build up known as gumming in the pump body and bearing surfaces. Eventually the pump locks up.

z80

A hint....the temperature gauge says its cold all the time....???

and one of the heater hoses was dripping water, had a pinhole leak,and he said he had to keep topping up with water all the time...?


No sputter, this car starts with a clik of the key.......but it dies, like the key has been turned off, then restarts instantly.


Tried fuel pump, and distributor....and ecu......(yes i have a spare car to swap with)


I can hear the fuel pump working, it sounds smooth ....when they go i think they sound a bit erratic on that model.

intelliGEORGE

What model is it?

best4less

I would get every wiring harness and shake the shit out of each one and see if it will die on you, worth 15 minutes LOL you never know

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z80

R31, 1987 model with CA20E 8 spark plug, 4 cylinder 2.0 litre engine.

same as in Bluebird series 3 and Gazelle.

Godzilla

Hmmm thanks more info to unfold the mystery.....

Yes water temp sensor....Derrrrr. Maybe try unplugging it and shorting it to earth to see if the guage rises.

Or...No water or an airlock causing the sensor to not register?

Give it a test zed and get back.

z80

It has TWO sensors, one seems to go to the ECU, the other to the gauges.

I am just guessing that maybe they are BOTH stuffed?

The one to the ecu needs half the crap around it to be removed....

So am reluctant to do it unless it's a good thing to try....

Am unsure of it's opertaion, but why would an ecu need it's own water sensor?

intelliGEORGE

Have you looked at the codes on the ECM?

To clear:
1. Turn the ignition to the ON position.
2. Turn the diagnosis mode selector fully CLOCKWISE and leave it in that position for at least 2 seconds.
3. Turn the diagnosis mode selector fully ANTI-CLOCKWISE and leave it in that position for at least 2 seconds.
4. Turn the ignition to the OFF position.

Test Procedure:
1. Turn the diagnosis mode selector fully ANTI-CLOCKWISE.
2. Turn the ignition to the ON position and ensure the LED's remain lit.
3. Turn the diagnosis mode selector fully CLOCKWISE.
4. Start the engine and allow it to idle. (Cancels Code 32)
5. Drive the vehicle at a speed greater than 10km/hr. (Cancels Code 14)
6. Stop the engine and turn the ignition switch back to the ON position.
7. Depress and release the throttle pedal. (Cancels code 23)
8. Move the transmission shift lever from neutral to any other gear and then back to neutral. (Cancels Code 24)
9. On vehicles equipped with A/C, turn the A/C and heater fan from OFF to ON and then OFF again. (Cancels Code 31)
10. Note the remaining code(s) displayed from the ECU. On vehicles not equipped with A/C, Code 31 indicates no faults have been detected. On vehicles equipped with A/C, Code 44 indicates no faults have been detected.

Interpreting Diagnosis Codes:
To identify the code number, count the number of flashes of the red and green LED's. The red LED represents tens and the green LED represents single units. For example, if 1 flash on the red LED is followed by 3 flashes on the green LED, this would be code number 13. Similarly, if 2 flashes on the red LED are followed by 4 flashes on the green LED, the code number is 24.

If more than one fault is present, the self diagnosis system will indicate each one in numerical order, with a pause between each series of flashes, and then begin the sequence again.

The fault codes can be identified as follows:

CODES
11 Crank Angle Sensor
12 Air Flow Meter
13 Coolant Temperature Sensor
14 Vehicle speed Sensor
21 Ignition signal
22 Fuel pump
23 Throttle switch
24 Neutral switch
31 No faults detected (non A/C models)
A/C and heater switch (A/C models)
44 No faults detected (A/C models)

Godzilla

To control the engine management.

Check your connections and wireing harness (as mentioned earlier in post 2+9) mate, this sounds like more than meets the eye.

z80

@intelligeorge...that's great will try that in the morning !

intelliGEORGE

Hopefully it will show up. Luckily you only have 8 codes to deal with, my senator has about 80.

best4less

They have sure come a long way since my old Ford XB coupe LOL

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intelliGEORGE

Tell me about it, a flat blade screw driver and a pair of pliers is all I needed for my HZ premiere. Now I got a laptop in the boot of my car running EFI Live to my in-dash monitor, I'd be screwed where to look without the bloody ECU codes.

Godzilla

Lol even they can lead you on a goose chase.

At least they narrow it down alot.

Which ECU are you running George?

dogsbreath

Had a 89 version of the same car.
Engine was knackered at 200k
Fully rebuilt engine, rebore, pistons, decked etc.
Ran perfect for the next 6 months. Got a camry from a relative. So advertised the car and the prospective buyers wanted a vehicle test done.
The mechanic tested it gave it the thumbs up.
Started to have similar problems straight after picking up from mechanics.
Spent hundreds with EFI specialist trying to nut it out only to drive out of their workshop to the same problem.
Ended up replacing major components from the wreckers - the final item which fixed the problem was the distributor. We believe that the mechanic when he compression tested the engine may have only pulled the leads off the plugs and not disconnected the coil causing internal damage to the electronics from surface arcing.
It is a similar injection system as the VL commodore only 4 cylinder.
The fuel pump voltage decreases at idle.