Thread: Signal but no quality on second box

Is the UEC box for VAST or Aurora?

Do you also have Foxtel, or are you just looking at signal levels for the Foxtel signals with the Arion or UEC decoders?

Foxtel transponders have higher output than Aurora and VAST.

Most Foxtel channels use horizontal polarisation, whereas both Aurora and VAST use vertical polarisation.

VAST is very particular with dish alignment and especially LNB skew, the latter being what I would be checking for first.

Moisture ingress to connections, especially at the LNB can also affect signals greatly.

Different decoders will show different signal readings, as they are not accurate, like professional signal measuring equipment.

A better comparison would be to take signal readings with the same decoder at the two outlets.

Cable type and length all contribute to how well a signal holds up.

Splitters should not be used for satellite frequencies, as they have significant loss.

Splitters may also rely on one decoder to power the LNB, which will also fix the polarisation to either horizontal or vertical and not offer fully-independent use between two separate discoders.

If you need to feed more than one decoder, it's best to use a dual LNB, with one output connected to each single-tuner decoder.

If you need more than two tuners/decoders, then a dual output LNB in conjuction with a multiswitch should be used.

Cheers mate.
I was under the impression the STB would still pickup the paytv (though scrambled) and aurora channels together regardless.
Just searching some more and it is a dual LNB already but it has a splitter on one line. What sort of setup would that be. Ah hold on it has foxtel on one line and the splitter/switch (Im not so sure now if it is a splitter or switch) on the decoders line.
Can the two Aurora decoders be on the same line and operate? Could the orignal installer put the second decoder plus foxtel box on the same line hence the foxtel channels taking predecence over aurora? Sorry for the Q/A Im literally 2 days into satellites and have a firm grasp on some of it but like most things it takes a bit. With the LNB settings I cannot tell anymore from the LNB due to age but it seems to have the strongest signal at 10700 hence 10.7 Lo but have tried all preset settings and some common settings. TIA

Get rid of any splitters and install a multiswitch.

You can get 4 and 8 output multiswitches.

Just connect the dual LNB (both outputs) to the multiswitch and then one cable from the multiswitch to each deocder (Foxtel, Arion and UEC).

The multiswitch will provide fully independent operation of all decoders connected to it, with no signal loss.

You may still need to adjust the LNB skew to improve the vertical Aurora transponders.

In case you are unaware, Aurora will cease operating early 2014.

VAST is the replacement for Aurora.

no worries thanks mate. Yeah I've helped a few people out with Vast but want to save the old duck a few dollars and not sure if she would get the benefits from spending the money vs time she might be around.

Originally Posted by budgey

no worries thanks mate. Yeah I've helped a few people out with Vast but want to save the old duck a few dollars and not sure if she would get the benefits from spending the money vs time she might be around.

If you have no signal quality, then you won't have pictures/sound... so I see actually having reliable reception as being quite beneficial.

Just a quickie though you mention signal loss. I really dont think thats the issue as signal is fine. Its just when it gets down to signal quality. Obvisouly it points towards a bad signal but both the UEC and Arion have the same signal and then for the problem box to have the PayTV channels come through and other FTA channels with great signal quality but none for aurora just doesnt make sense to me. As for the skew its set to the recommended 0 for our position.

Originally Posted by beer4life

You cannot decode the encrypted Pay TV without a valid Subscription Card in both boxes.

To decode Foxtel, valid Foxtel subscription smartcards must also be in a Foxtel decoder.... not a third-party decoder.

Originally Posted by beer4life

You're not listening!
You cannot decode the encrypted Pay TV without a valid Subscription Card in both boxes.
The ones you mention are FTA Promo Channels.
It would appear that the cottage is split off one of the House leads.
That means the cottage can only get the same Polarity signals as selected by the House box.
If the House box on that lead is tuned to Foxtel, you wont get any Quality Signals for Aurora at the cottage.
Follow previous advice, not some amateur guru.

Sorry if it seems that way but Im not trying to decode the subscription channels at all. It seems to me as I queried that the orignal installer has spilt/ switched the foxtel box line to the cottage like you have said and the foxtel like you said takes predecence over Aurora. I will have an indepth look at her physical setup and see if it makes a difference feeding a switch both LNB outputs and independant lines to each box. I still feel there is a missing link somewhere. Thanks for everyones advice

Originally Posted by budgey

Just a quickie though you mention signal loss. I really dont think thats the issue as signal is fine. Its just when it gets down to signal quality. Obvisouly it points towards a bad signal but both the UEC and Arion have the same signal and then for the problem box to have the PayTV channels come through and other FTA channels with great signal quality but none for aurora just doesnt make sense to me. As for the skew its set to the recommended 0 for our position.

Have to agree with beer on this one.... you're not listening!

You cannot compare Foxtel horizontally-polarised signals with lower-powered vertically-powered Aurora signals.

You need to adjust the LNB skew whilst measuring the signal quality.

Signal quality is the most important factor for digital reception (both terrestrial and satellite) signal strength, whilst still required, is less important than signal quality.

Without sufficient signal quality, you won't have reception.

Originally Posted by budgey

Sorry if it seems that way but Im not trying to decode the subscription channels at all. It seems to me as I queried that the orignal installer has spilt/ switched the foxtel box line to the cottage like you have said and the foxtel like you said takes predecence over Aurora. I will have an indepth look at her physical setup and see if it makes a difference feeding a switch both LNB outputs and independant lines to each box. I still feel there is a missing link somewhere. Thanks for everyones advice

With a dual output LNB... if one output is going directly to a Foxtel decoder, it will operate independently from the other LNB output, so it will not overide the Aurora boxes.

How the signal is divided between the two Aurora decoders will determine how well they will work.

If one of the Aurora decoders is tuned to a horizontal channel and that decoder is on a power pass leg of a splitter, it will prevent the other docoder on the splitter from tuning a vertical channel (eg: Aurora).

Vertical is 13VDC, horizontal is 18VDC... the highest voltage will have control.

The setup is incorrect for the purpose....install a multiswitch as advised for the best result...... and adjust the LNB skew correctly, not just by a recommended setting.... it's skew must be fine-tuned for it to operate correctly.

The UEC box which is working is set to 12407 30000 v 2/3. So its pointing towards that the foxtel line is def the line that is split with the cottage decoder. If both operating off the vert which they should be (arion and UEC on aurora) if I swapped the fox out onto its own LNB and the other 2 through what I assume to be the splitter on the second LNB would that work? I know your saying switch it but if I can use existing hardware would be a bonus. Sorry bout my lengthy posts Im trying to convey as much info as possible to avoid confusion and failing miserably

How about forgetting all about assumptions and find out exactly how it's all configured first.

If the Foxtel box and an Aurora box are sharing a splitter... that will cause the problem.

Whoever installed the extra outlet obviously has no idea what they are doing.

You may still have power pass problems if both Aurora boxes are sharing a splitter.

Just fit a multiswitch.... no more guessing or experimenting needed.

Problem solved. The cottage was indeed on the same line as the fox. Turned off fox to make sure and all good. Quick and easy fix swapped UEC and fox cables to opposite outlet and no dramas both UEC and arion on same line operating crystal clear and independantly. Thanks for the insight I would never of know the fox would of done that it was driving me nuts trap for young players cheers.

Originally Posted by budgey

Problem solved. The cottage was indeed on the same line as the fox. Turned off fox to make sure and all good. Quick and easy fix swapped UEC and fox cables to opposite outlet and no dramas both UEC and arion on same line operating crystal clear and independantly. Thanks for the insight I would never of know the fox would of done that it was driving me nuts trap for young players cheers.

Thanks for the update... pleased you got it sorted.

If the splitter has power pass on both legs, either box will power the LNB.

If only power pass on one leg, the box connected to the power pass leg must be turned on, otherwise the box on the non power pass leg will not get signal.

Originally Posted by budgey

Problem solved. The cottage was indeed on the same line as the fox. Turned off fox to make sure and all good. Quick and easy fix swapped UEC and fox cables to opposite outlet and no dramas both UEC and arion on same line operating crystal clear and independantly. Thanks for the insight I would never of know the fox would of done that it was driving me nuts trap for young players cheers.

As everyone has been saying try a multiswitch if you plan to do any further sat stuff at your place. It will simplify further expansion and provides a small signal boost too (woohoo! :P). It will also mean that you dont need to progress beyond a double LNB for a long time yet :P