Nrma - Page 2

**watchdog** · 09-08-08, 04:00 PM

a few thoughts cross my mind -

a) A master licence does not entitle you to sell security
equipment
b) Has PT been nominated as a close associate

OR

are these just rules the little people have to follow ?

**keef82** · 09-08-08, 04:10 PM

Very interesting.
I always thought these people would need a master license for their security systems ?

At least @ HN the system is installed by a Technician (not DIY) and is of some respectable quality.

**intelliGEORGE** · 09-08-08, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sydneytech

i fell of a ladder this weak and broke my arm and sholder plaster for months so maybe i should get some of these handymen weekend nrma installers to come round and do my installs and service work and while they are at it they can scratch my balls. they dont need a licence for that either

Do you really want to do that? It'd be a sure way to lose your customers.

It doesn't matter, like I have said before it's good that there are people like this in the industry, makes us blokes look like gods at what we do.

**watchdog** · 09-08-08, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keef82

Very interesting.
I always thought these people would need a master license for their security systems ?

At least @ HN the system is installed by a Technician (not DIY) and is of some respectable quality.

Keef - They do have a master licence but refer to my previous post

**fastwrx** · 10-08-08, 03:08 PM

You know, Angela Hunter, "Head of NRMA Home Security" is doing a talk 26th August 7.30 to 9.30 at the Asial show, maybe a few disgruntled Onewatch contractors and ex NRMA techs should turn up and heckle her from the sidelines.

Then again, she really wouldn't know WTF they are selling these days. She never did in the past.

As George said, they make us look good, we won 3 jobs off them last week. One even had a install booked with them and canceled when we suggested he ring a check to see if the "quote" he received as in fact a quote or an estimate, and if it may vary in the day of installation

**keef82** · 10-08-08, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fastwrx

You know, Angela Hunter, "Head of NRMA Home Security" is doing a talk 26th August 7.30 to 9.30 at the Asial show, maybe a few disgruntled Onewatch contractors and ex NRMA techs should turn up and heckle her from the sidelines.

What happened to one watch?

Would be very interesting to go and see what she says, then hit them up on their business ethics, e.g DIY alarm installs. I really would like to see how some of these systems are being installed, mode 3, cabling e.t.c

Then again, she really wouldn't know WTF they are selling these days. She never did in the past.

As George said, they make us look good, we won 3 jobs off them last week. One even had a install booked with them and canceled when we suggested he ring a check to see if the "quote" he received as in fact a quote or an estimate, and if it may vary in the day of installation

Wth? so u call up and they "estimate" based on what you tell them ?
No sales people come to customize the system? it's a "one size fits all" ?
WOW!

**fastwrx** · 10-08-08, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keef82

Wth? so u call up and they "estimate" based on what you tell them ?
No sales people come to customize the system? it's a "one size fits all" ?
WOW!

Onewatch went into liquidation a month or so after the CEO resigned, with debts of approx $400k

In essence they "estimate" over the phone. In reality it works well most of the time, it's just if the customer wasn't honest with the description of the premises to the consultant it all goes pear shaped.

NRMA consultants have to be honest when dealing with customers, so we find it easy to poison their "quotes" when going against them. All's fair I reckon.

The DIY system they flog is all plug and play wireless. plug into GPO, plug into telephone jack (it really doesn't need to be mode 3 does it?) and screw PIR's to wall....get tech out to see if they balls it up. Simple

**manicretep** · 10-08-08, 07:39 PM

yeah RACQ (same as NRMA/ RACQ but in qld) went into security, guess who runs it now.

SSG...

well same as FAI- the cig c bought it and has a massive database....

**watchdog** · 11-08-08, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sydneytech

How do you check this out ? will it make a difference anyway. do they need to?

I don't know how you could check this out , the SIR would be the ONLY place but I doubt they would tell you (I could be wrong)
As for the other then if you are selling security and have an arrangement for a third party to install it then yes I would call that a close associate. When I checked a couple of years ago I was told that if I subbied on a regular basis to another security Co then I had to declare them as a close associate. Stuff it - you've got me going now so I'm off to ring the SIR and see how I go

**keef82** · 11-08-08, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fastwrx

Onewatch went into liquidation a month or so after the CEO resigned, with debts of approx $400k

In essence they "estimate" over the phone. In reality it works well most of the time, it's just if the customer wasn't honest with the description of the premises to the consultant it all goes pear shaped.

NRMA consultants have to be honest when dealing with customers, so we find it easy to poison their "quotes" when going against them. All's fair I reckon.

The DIY system they flog is all plug and play wireless. plug into GPO, plug into telephone jack (it really doesn't need to be mode 3 does it?) and screw PIR's to wall....get tech out to see if they balls it up. Simple

Its all fun and games till u leave the phone off the hook :P
Mode 3 is a very important part of any security system..

But still, dodge man... DIY install to a professional monitoring centre. wow.

**bss904** · 11-08-08, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keef82

Its all fun and games till u leave the phone off the hook :P
Mode 3 is a very important part of any security system..

But still, dodge man... DIY install to a professional monitoring centre. wow.

I guess to some, the dollar is more important than reputation.

**keef82** · 12-08-08, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bss904

I guess to some, the dollar is more important than reputation.

Yeah True, i mean if they had a technician installing it, at least you know the system is installed to a standard, the whole diy thing is the issue here.

**fastwrx** · 12-08-08, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bss904

I guess to some, the dollar is more important than reputation.

Well, let me set up a scenario for you.

If you have a break and enter insurance claim, typically to get insured again you are required to install an alarm system......

Fill in the blanks...

**watchdog** · 12-08-08, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watchdog

I don't know how you could check this out , the SIR would be the ONLY place but I doubt they would tell you (I could be wrong)
As for the other then if you are selling security and have an arrangement for a third party to install it then yes I would call that a close associate. When I checked a couple of years ago I was told that if I subbied on a regular basis to another security Co then I had to declare them as a close associate. Stuff it - you've got me going now so I'm off to ring the SIR and see how I go

Well looks like I'm wrong again. Close associates only refers to financial , not working association. They will not divulge that info to the public (or me). I did again ask them what I would need to do to sell security equipment without a licence like DS does & again they were lost for an answer. But If I put my circumstances down in writing they would look at it & get back to me. The SIR have a new queuing system that lets you know how many calls are ahead of you. I was pleasantly surprised that they had not set the recording to permanently say there are 50 calls in the queue just to make you piss off

**MCman** · 13-08-08, 11:36 AM

Hi All,
FWIW, you dont need a licence to sell security if the company's total sales of security products is less than 10% of the companies total sales ala DSE/jaycar/bunnings etc, same applies for NRMA/RACQ.
They are also allowed to sell direct to the public without any knowledge, certificates, licences or police checks.
They are not allowed to install, but then i guess it is sort of a grey are because the alarm is wireless and no cabling is needed.
Wait till you see what bunning and officeworks are about to sell...

rgds
MCMan

**watchdog** · 13-08-08, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MCman

Hi All,
FWIW, you dont need a licence to sell security if the company's total sales of security products is less than 10% of the companies total sales ala DSE/jaycar/bunnings etc, same applies for NRMA/RACQ.
They are also allowed to sell direct to the public without any knowledge, certificates, licences or police checks.
They are not allowed to install, but then i guess it is sort of a grey are because the alarm is wireless and no cabling is needed.
Wait till you see what bunning and officeworks are about to sell...
It is a joke-

rgds
MCMan

I've been down this path many times with them , its a form of recreaction for me. Every person at the sir you talk to will give a different answer. I suggested that I would like to mow lawns & clean pools during summer & sell the odd security system in winter. They weren't impressed.

I did talk to Phil Houlton ( ex SIR head honcho) and he stated off the record that it was really left to the individual to determine if a licence was required. If you decided wrongly & the sir (or police ) was looking to get you then you would be got. Even though the regs talk about exemptions there are none in existance & the SIR will not entertain the prospect of formally exempting ANYONE.

**MCman** · 14-08-08, 03:00 PM

Sure. Of course in other words they wouldnt be able to take bunnings, DSE etc to court but the average joe is different. It's part of the "we are all treated equally" thing. At least we can afford to pay for a licence....
Cheers MCMan

**manicretep** · 15-08-08, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sydneytech

If every security company in Auzzy all got together and sent all our licences back with a go get Fugged letter attached they would all be screwed.

Then when they issue the first fine we all banded together at say 20 bucks each for a class action they would be screwed.

Just paid the $690 for firms,
$ 166.90 for installer/advisors license
$ 136.00 for security officers
$35.50 for police check..

So then you add my cablers license, costs involved in getting that, I.R certification etc etc someones making money for nothing

09-08-08, 04:00 PM	#21 (permalink)
watchdog Senior Member iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 256 Spent time on board: 4 Days and 22:43:46	a few thoughts cross my mind - a) A master licence does not entitle you to sell security equipment b) Has PT been nominated as a close associate OR are these just rules the little people have to follow ? __________________ Licenced security installer & Trainer

13-08-08, 11:36 AM	#36 (permalink)
MCman Junior Member iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 4 Spent time on board: 3:38:45	licence to sell security Hi All, FWIW, you dont need a licence to sell security if the company's total sales of security products is less than 10% of the companies total sales ala DSE/jaycar/bunnings etc, same applies for NRMA/RACQ. They are also allowed to sell direct to the public without any knowledge, certificates, licences or police checks. They are not allowed to install, but then i guess it is sort of a grey are because the alarm is wireless and no cabling is needed. Wait till you see what bunning and officeworks are about to sell... rgds MCMan

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09-08-08, 04:10 PM	#22 (permalink)
keef82 Senior Member iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 307 Spent time on board: 1 Day and 23:02:58	Very interesting. I always thought these people would need a master license for their security systems ? At least @ HN the system is installed by a Technician (not DIY) and is of some respectable quality.

10-08-08, 03:08 PM	#25 (permalink)
fastwrx Premium Member iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 46 Spent time on board: 2 Days and 22:41:21	You know, Angela Hunter, "Head of NRMA Home Security" is doing a talk 26th August 7.30 to 9.30 at the Asial show, maybe a few disgruntled Onewatch contractors and ex NRMA techs should turn up and heckle her from the sidelines. Then again, she really wouldn't know WTF they are selling these days. She never did in the past. As George said, they make us look good, we won 3 jobs off them last week. One even had a install booked with them and canceled when we suggested he ring a check to see if the "quote" he received as in fact a quote or an estimate, and if it may vary in the day of installation

10-08-08, 07:39 PM	#28 (permalink)
manicretep Registered User iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Da boondocks Posts: 94	yeah RACQ (same as NRMA/ RACQ but in qld) went into security, guess who runs it now. SSG... well same as FAI- the cig c bought it and has a massive database....

14-08-08, 03:00 PM	#38 (permalink)
MCman Junior Member iTrader: (0) Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 4 Spent time on board: 3:38:45	Sure. Of course in other words they wouldnt be able to take bunnings, DSE etc to court but the average joe is different. It's part of the "we are all treated equally" thing. At least we can afford to pay for a licence.... Cheers MCMan

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