A Win Over Coles AND The Union
Glad this guy won this....ought to be a lesson to BOTH sides but sadly, probably won't.....
Ought to be a lesson to the average worker too but sadly, probably won't.....
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
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Ought to be a lesson for M. Turnbull as well given he defended the original deal in QT at the time.
Whilst IMHO big business in AU can NEVER be trusted to do the 'right thing', I wonder what 'incentives' the union organizers received from coles to do the dirty deal
eaglem (01-06-16),VroomVroom (31-05-16)
Money, just like Shorten and his union did for selling out the cleaners in Melbourne probably.Originally Posted by alpha0ne
Whilst IMHO big business in AU can NEVER be trusted to do the 'right thing', I wonder what 'incentives' the union organizers received from coles to do the dirty deal
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Why do you assume the organizers received some incentive to allow a less than favourable deal to go through ?Whilst IMHO big business in AU can NEVER be trusted to do the 'right thing', I wonder what 'incentives' the union organizers received from coles to do the dirty deal
I was only ever on the periphery of any sort of Negations and I soon learnt that the words of the Kenny Rogers song about knowing when to deal and when to fold are very important in real life regarding negotiations.
You can be as hard as you like in your negotiations but there is point, like going on strike as the last resort will achieve nothing but a further loss to the workers.
During a couple of strikes I was affected by, I did wonder if the employer actually was pleased they happened as there were huge cost savings to them as well as the workers being blamed for causing some much disruption by going on strike.
During the Viet Nam war there were chronic staff shortages and many 'Gains' were made by the employee's, but when the staffing situation eventually reversed, the 'Shoe' was soon on the other foot.
I stand unequivicably behind everything I say, I just dont ever remember saying it !!
so much for the union looking after the workers , sold them out most likely
exited (01-06-16)
There are 3 parties that have contributed to the situation, most definitely Coles, and the Union, if I was a member I'd be asking myself why am I paying dues to this mob, but most of all the biggest guilty party is the Fair Work Commission themselves, although the agreement was voted in, it still had to pass the BOOT test (Better Off Overall Test) this is performed by the FWC themselves, so regardless of what Coles did, or what the Union did, and what the majority of voters voted for, the question still remains is why did this guy even have to go to the FWC in the first place, it was the FWC who approved the agreement so who applied the BOOT?
Cheers
Ted (Al)
alpha0ne (01-06-16),bob_m_54 (01-06-16),exited (31-05-16),mtv (31-05-16),VroomVroom (01-06-16)
Agreed, Al.
FWC is supposed to be the watchdog and ensuring all agreements are in fact... fair.
It was interesting how CUB always had a summer strike when the supply was adequate
SDA union? That says it all. It has long been perceived as a bosses union instead of a workers union.
I like this bit >>> "Other unions claim the SDA undercut wages and conditions in agreements, and allow penalty rates to be cut in exchange for higher wages. Paul Conway, secretary of left-wing Victorian meatworkers union, claims "The SDA is a tame cat union. Its primary interest is not its members but numbers in the Trade Union Council and Labor" and "getting its people into Parliament". Joe de Bruyn defends the SDA's industrial record, claiming a tenfold increase in the award rate for shop assistants and, pay increases above inflation, since the mid-1970s. The Sydney Morning-Herald reports that the SDA pays as much as $5 million a year in commissions to big employers, including Coles and Woolworths, in return for payroll deduction of union dues."
This is where it gets interesting... >>> [EX] employment minister Eric Abetz said SDA national president “Joe de Bruyn is a role model of trade union officialdom. He is the type of official who gives trade unionism a good name"
It therefore comes as no surprise that the SDA has been exempted from the government’s Royal Commission into trade union corruption.
In light of these facts, the SDA has clearly demonstrated that it is not a union that acts in the interests of its members.
That's one union I wouldn't join
I think you will find the Union actually had ALL their members interests in mind.
An agreement that keeps maximum employment verses less members would be a serious consideration.
All business has a budget and needs to stick to it. Unlike our stupid government.
If costs go up so do prices. To maintain prices you need to reduce costs, ergo shed staff.
I would rather work for a little less and be employed instead of unemployed.
A union that agrees to rip off workers to the point of being illegal has NO members interests in mind. Workers have budgets as well.
This illegal agreement is just another scabby anti penalty rate political statement.
I wonder how much input the workers had. Did they actually get to vote on the agreed EBA. When I was working for a very large aircraft industry company (10 years ago), the workers willingly signed individual contracts that gave them an increase of about $2,000 per annum, but took away overtime rates. The condition of overtime was that they "may be required to work a reasonable amount of overtime, from time to time." Myself and a couple of others remained on the original contract, that included over time rates, and made the extra $2,000 within 3 to 6 months. The guys who signed weren't very amused......
When I was last in full time work (pre 2001), we signed an agreement to scrap variable penalty rates. We averaged what we earned over 5 years working shifts 24hrs/day, 365 days a year and agreed to a flat 29.5% loading that included sick leave and rec leave.....which turned out well for all of us.
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Yes, if you do your homework, it can be beneficial. But some guys just see dollars in front of them and sign up without a clue.
I had read, the SDA"is an extreme right wing union with more in common with the liberal party than labor, headed by catholic members, a carry over from the DLP"!
Not my words but !Think you will find Bill Shorten is reliant on this and similar unions to stay in power
Sorry have not the time to connect to links as i am a day late paying my accounts
There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"
Absolutely. But how many workers actually get to have input to EBA's ? Pretty much none. Then they just play games with you rolling them over in to new ones once the first has been approved.
Unions are absolute sell outs on EBA's, more often than not the worker will lose out. Bill Shorten showed everyone that when he was caught selling workers out at Cleanevent and Chiquita Mushrooms.
My wife works full time, but her working week incorporates night shift along with Saturday and Sunday nights. She had no input to the EBA she works under, even though she has worked at the same workplace for 8 years. Even when there is a vote, most employees dont vote. So its not hard for the union to find a few sucks to vote for it. Job done.
As has been shown in this case, you are better off taking on your employer yourself than bothering to contact your union. The SDA supplies almost the same EBA to Woolworths, but wont provide the same EBA to IGA (Independent Grocers Association) so that they are hamstrung on wages and cant challenge the top 2. Collusion at its best. Coles pays the Union $25,000 a year for "training" in return. The SDA also pays Coles 5 million dollars a year to for collecting and processing employee union fees. Coles and Woolworths also hand out union membership applications to new employees.
The sole superannuation fund nominated in the agreement is REST, the union-#affiliated industry super fund whose union trustees are dominated by SDA officials. Coles supermarket workers are given no choice about which super#annuation fund to join.
Unless workers opt out of the REST insurance arrangements (selected by default), premiums are deducted automatically from the workers’ super accounts, even though there is no payout in the event of death or total disability unless the account contains at least $3000. So if you are a student, you are paying money for absolutely nothing.
It doesnt matter how many times its proven outright that the Labor Party and Unions are ripping off workers, people just dont seem to get it.
Pffftttt...they finance the Labor Party ! It doesnt matter what union it is, all roads lead to the Labor Party. From Wikipedia :
"Labor figures estimate that federally there are 10-12 MPs with some level of SDA link, including lower house members Tony Burke, Nick Champion, Kate Ellis, David Feeney and Amanda Rishworth and upper house members Catryna Bilyk, Joe Bullock, Jacinta Collins, Chris Ketter, Deborah O'Neill and Helen Polley. Many SDA linked MPs do so, not out of religious or ideological belief, but because the powerful union is seen as a good avenue to a political career".
Its a standard defence line from the Labor Left because the SDA former long serving president is Catholic. If you are a member of the Labor Party and dont support Gay Marriage you are viewed as some sort of criminal.He also holds a position on Labor's National Executive.
For a right wing union, they had no problem bank rolling Danial Andrews who is from the Loony Socialist Left.
Actually, in the case I illustrated, it wasn't an EBA, it was a straight out Individual Agreement. And the employers had no intention of negotiating anything with employees, it was a case of that's what we are offering, take it or leave it. Most of the guys didn't give it a second thought, they just saw the extra dollars and justified it by saying "we don't do overtime anyway, so why not take it"
Guess what happened a couple of months after 90% of the workforce took up the new agreement. Yep, that "Reasonable amount of overtime" was called in. And even the wording of "Reasonable amount" was open to interpretation between team leaders. (Our said "no more than an hour or so per day") It was a bloody joke. I never used to look for overtime, but once the other guys weren't getting paid any extra for it, they made all the excuses under the sun why they couldn't, so the team leader kept asking me to do it. So to prove a point, I did 5 hours a week (which is bugger all), and made more in 4 months, than the $2,000 extra they got for the year. And weren't they pissed off about it.. LOL
Eventually after a lot of hoohar errupted over unreasonable expectations by the company, we did have collectively bargained individual agreements. It was basically an EBA, but the company didn't want to have, or know anything about an EBA as it wasn't their policy. And the workers did have some input by means of an elected committee. Ovetime, confined space and other penalty rates were reinstated and the boys were happy again.
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