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Thread: Push for digital radio DAB+ switch

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    Default Push for digital radio DAB+ switch




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    Yes, we are slow adopters compared to America.

    But really, do we need it?
    And does it bring more Positives than Negatives?

    At least with what we have currently, Radio reception, especially in cars is like the old analogue phone and will fade in and out but still be audible.
    Where as Digital will just be on or off, probably not the best driving experience in regional areas.
    Last edited by ol' boy; 20-09-16 at 03:19 AM.
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    I wonder do any of these Genius' ever look beyond the window box of their cubicle and see just how practical some of their ideas are ??
    For most metro areas I dont doubt Digital Radio is workable both in the home and on the road but if getting a reception is anything like the problems encounted with Digital Terrestrial TV, Home reception without an external antenna may be marginal and as for driving, with places like Sydney with its erratic topography may make it difficult for any reception at all.
    I cant see the Regional Broadcasters busting a Gut to introduce Digital Radio for financial reasons mostly.
    Most towns have an AM station, one Commercial FM and maybe a Radio National (ABC) along with a low powered Volunteer run Community FM station and I doubt many of them would be making huge profits.
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    That's it Gordon.
    Its completely different to Television, where the hardware keeps advancing 1080p now 4k.
    screens get larger, brighter, faster...

    Radio...
    What's happened?
    Did someone start making Digital Speakers for our Non Digital ears?

    In my view, DAB is dead...
    Radio has gone to Internet Streaming.
    Broadcasting is simple, whole world audience ....
    Both Fixed and Mobile solutions already working...
    The amount of Aussies that live and/or work abroad, that tune into SEN for Live AFL football is nuts.

    Someone pls explain how DAB fits in?
    Last edited by ol' boy; 20-09-16 at 03:00 PM.
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    The pluses are a lot more stations, especially niche programming, of which many are not streamed.

    Streaming relies on data usage = $ and requires use of a device (computer, smartphone, tablet, etc) to receive it.

    Yes, your phone can be paired to many car radios via Bluetooth, but you still need reliable reception of the data, which for mobile devices can be costly if online streaming is used a lot, depending on your data plan of course.

    Naturally, with a DAB+ radio, it's free once the purchase price is paid, or included with your car, etc.

    Apart from more stations, I personally don't find any benefit from listening to FM.

    It's a bit like TV programming.... look at all the additional channels we have these days, but do we watch them all?.... I certainly don't.

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    In fact, look at all the Pay TV channels we have how much replayed crap is on them.
    Streaming Radio uses bugger all data, compared to Streaming TV
    So by the time you pick out the show you wish to listen too or a live sports event, you are really only Streaming for 2 hours.

    Anyone can afford that bandwidth these days, and they already have the equipment and plan to do so.

    But like you say mtv, FM with a proper FM antenna provides some dam good results
    Especially a fixed 3 or 5 element FM antenna

    Considering the other Technology and Delivery methods around, DAB+ was Dead on Arrival.
    If it were a company, you'd be a very brave man to buy shares in it.

    But, as Automotive manufactures begin to install DAB+ to all vehicles, i think VW has that view, things may change.

    Until there is an Analogue Switch Off Date, why is there any incentive to change?
    And by the time it does, 6G will be here and 5G will be the norm...

    If FM stopped today, i bet most would start using Internet Streaming.
    DAB+ is massively underused broadcast spectrum that will become a huge white elephant for the Government, when no one wants to pay for a licence for it.

    But lets see how it goes.
    They'd want to pump some money into coverage before they start blowing that horn.



    ^^^ Above is a website where you can put your postcode in and it will tell you if you have coverage.
    All 3 address's i added had No Coverage.
    Last edited by ol' boy; 20-09-16 at 04:28 PM.
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    I have dab+ in my car and it's actually next to useless due to drop outs. I use it at home with greater success though.

    My fav method of radio is Pandora Internet streaming.
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    Ballarat: 100,000 people, No DAB+
    Warranmbool: 30,000 people, No DAB+
    Geelong: 250,000 people, No DAB+
    Bendigo: 110,000 people, No DAB+

    Not even worth checking more places.
    I'm fairly sure all of the above 3G, 4G, ADSL and NBN.
    Last edited by ol' boy; 20-09-16 at 07:08 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanboy View Post
    Ballarat: 100,000 people, No DAB+
    Warranmbool: 30,000 people, No DAB+
    Geelong: 250,000 people, No DAB+
    Bendigo: 110,000 people, No DAB+

    Not even worth checking more places.
    I'm fairly sure all of the above 3G, 4G, ADSL and NBN.
    Pretty sure DAB+ is still limited to only some of the capital cities at the moment. Not much coverage beyond that. I don't think population size has much to do with it.

    Quote Originally Posted by gordon_s1942 View Post
    Most towns have an AM station, one Commercial FM and maybe a Radio National (ABC) along with a low powered Volunteer run Community FM station and I doubt many of them would be making huge profits.
    With digital radio those 4 stations could all feasibly operate off the one frequency, which means only one transmitter, one tower, etc instead of 4 - that equates to massive savings and frees up spectrum for other uses.

    But as you and others point out there are many downsides and now competition from other sources.
    Last edited by peteramjet; 21-09-16 at 06:07 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanboy View Post
    Ballarat: 100,000 people, No DAB+
    Warranmbool: 30,000 people, No DAB+
    Geelong: 250,000 people, No DAB+
    Bendigo: 110,000 people, No DAB+

    Not even worth checking more places.
    I'm fairly sure all of the above 3G, 4G, ADSL and NBN.
    Gold Coast: Population 500,000...No DAB+

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    And Digital TV, both Pay and FTA is going IPTV
    (Most supplementary, some as the main and only broadcast spectrum)
    What does that say?

    DAB+ and 3D TV can be best mates at the tip, cos that is where they both headed, before they even began.

    Just look at other countries, Geo small countries like Sweden, its over.

    The Constitutional Standing Committee (KU) in Riksdagen (the Parliament) has processed the government missive regarding the 2015 National Audit review of digital radio in which the proposal for a transition from FM to DAB+ in 2017-2022 was rejected. After a short debate and without objection from any of the eight political parties Riksdagen today appended the missive to the protocol. This marks the end of 24 years of efforts to replace FM with DAB in Sweden
    Although, Indonesia with 250Million people just launched DAB+ this year
    Norway has announced the closure of FM in 2017.

    Im not saying DAB+ wont be here, obviously it has to fill some legislation regarding "Public Free Access".....
    But, how much will it be used?

    The DAB+ tuners will have to be implemented into Smartphones and Similar devices if it is to survive.
    That's if we ever get coverage

    There is a lot of weight on the Automotive Industry get this change across the line
    Last edited by ol' boy; 21-09-16 at 09:49 AM.
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    To me population equal advertising revenue and there must be a number where it becomes practical to be able to support such a facility as DAB but when you see places with population figures as shown in those other postings and no Broadcasters champing at the bit to introduce DAB tells me how little interest there is in it.
    One mentioned that the Digital signal could contain all 4 signals that I said were common in many areas and that would indeed save money but the AM/FM stations seem to owned by one group as is the Radio National and the Community channel which here broadcast from their own location.

    Back when the FM licenses (rural) were being introduced, I got the impression then that in many cases the only ones interested in obtaining the FM license already owned the local AM station because of the limited advertising revenue due to the population of the area.
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    I was happy when FM started broadcasting in mid 70s but a little disappointed with DAB performance..

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    I was a little disappointed with AM stereo as well
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    AM stereo was another 'Let's Run it up the Flagpole and see who's awake' soon found out no one was!

    If I bought a DAB radio and I was in a good reception area, just how MANY channels/Stations would I expect to be able to receive on this radio?
    I stand unequivicably behind everything I say , I just dont ever remember saying it !!

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    Perhaps one significant factor that is overlooked in this discussion is that DAB+ receivers are very power hungry.
    Even if there were broad coverage, the acceptance of battery powered receivers that constantly cut-off due to under voltage would (and has) rendered the format to the annals of history.
    DAB+ receivers are enormously current hungry and two AA batteries are not going to live very long in this application.
    Radio is a very personal and immediate medium, most often enjoyed in-car or at home. The ubiquity of low cost, low current AM/FM receivers makes the prospect of migration to VHF DAB+ an unlikely scenario.
    Medium Wave AM is extraordinarily efficient for coverage. I have a Sangean deep fringe AM receiver that happily receives Sydney stations in the ACT. Runs on four D-cells that last for six months with daily use.
    Outside of the capital cities, who cares?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyPatrol View Post
    I was a little disappointed with AM stereo as well
    Quite the contrary to your experience Leroy, I was very impressed with the C-QuAM system.
    For the 9 kHz bandwidth allocated (and complete backward compatibility), it equalled FM IMHO. Sadly it has gone.
    Last edited by TVguy; 25-09-16 at 01:14 PM.
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    A multiband handheld analogue radio with a micro controlling it with countless trick modes, memories, scanning patterns and what not will run for over 100 hours on 3 AA cells. An upgrade model with a 'digital' analogue radio in it is rated at over 200 hours, on 3 AA cells.

    DAB+ radios suck the life out of a similar battery in 10 hours.

    The supposed reason for introducing DAB in Australia was spectrum crowding in the capital cities. Once you get out of those high population areas there is usually plenty of space available so I can't honestly see DAB being introduced country wide let alone a general switch to digital broadcasts and analogue being turned off any time soon. Even 20 years out may be optimistic.

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    "The campaign likens the switch to DAB+ to the transition of TV from analogue to digital, and focuses on the benefits of upgrading, including better sound quality and up to 30 extra stations."

    "We" had no choice but to go digital TV. "We" have x number of extra channels - how many of those do "we" watch.

    "We" have only two ears so ...
    If Australia is a democracy why, then, is voting compulsory?

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