Do you support Euthanasia ?

[admin]

I see Victoria is on the way



I made it it a simple, Yes, No or Unsure if you are on the fence.

For the record, I am in the No camp (thank #### I didnt have to change my avatar).

Daniel Andrews is claiming its the most conservative system in the world. So were all the other overseas systems originally.

Oregon in the US, Belgium and the Netherlands are the best known. Here are some cases they have performed in recent years :

IN 2014, a Dutch woman in her 20s asked for euthanasia because she had an “incurable” post-traumatic stress disorder and anorexia, which was apparently caused by being sexually abused as a girl.


The Dutch Euthanasia Commission said she had become almost bedridden.


So doctors killed her, even though her condition had improved somewhat after intensive therapy.





MARK Langedijk, a 41-year-old father of two, failed 21 times in eight years to kick his alcoholism.


His parents thought he’d one day make it, but Langedijk insisted on death and was killed last year.





GABY Olthuis, 47, asked to die because she had severe tinnitus — a ringing and screeching in her ears. Sounds even became painful.


She was killed despite being the single mother of two teenagers.





IN 2010, only two people in Holland were given euthanasia because of their mental illness.


In 2015, the figure had soared to 56. Significantly, 36 were killed by Amsterdam’s End Of Life clinic, which sends mobile teams across Holland to kill patients in their own homes.


This clinic is run not by a doctor but a former information technology executive. Many of his clinic’s “patients” had been refused euthanasia by their own doctors.





A 54-YEAR-OLD woman with a pathological fear of germs or dirt asked End of Life to help her die.


A psychiatrist interviewed her and concluded: “All she could do all day was clean. It was impossible for her to maintain a relationship.”


She was killed.




A DUTCH divorcee with post-traumatic stress disorder, chronic depression and a personality disorder asked to die, even though she was just 34 and had a three-year-old daughter. An End Of Life psychiatrist said the woman “would commit suicide if I didn’t help her to die”.


So to stop her from killing herself, she was killed.


MOST people killed by euthanasia in Holland for psychiatric reasons had complained of loneliness, says a US National Institute of Health study.


It said 37 of 66 people it checked had given “social isolation” as a key motivation for wanting to die. The study, published in the Journal of the American Medical Association, said one woman of good mental and physical health was killed because she felt lonely after her husband’s death, even though she “did not feel depressed at all”.


Another patient “indicated she had a life without love and therefore had no right to exist”.





A 74-YEAR-OLD woman was diagnosed with dementia about six years ago and filled out a living will, saying she wished to die “when I myself find it the right time”.


She got worse, and wandered around her nursing home at night, scared and angry.


The nursing home doctor decided the woman was suffering unbearably, justifying the death she’d asked for in her will, even though she’d recently said she wanted to live.


The doctor put a sedative in the woman’s coffee, and inserted a drip into her arm to administer the poison. The woman tried to fight off the doctor, who then called in her relatives to hold her down until she was killed.


A regional oversight panel ruled the doctor had acted in good faith, but the case is going to court to set clearer guidelines.


Meanwhile, the Dutch keep weakening the laws.


Last year, the Justice Ministry allowed doctors to kill people with severe dementia who’d once said they wanted to die but couldn’t now make their wishes known.

For the screamers, the above is from Andrew Bolt, but its not hard to find information.

Almost a year ago, my father in law was taken to hospital with a suspected heart attack. He had been on at home Kidney dialysis for about 4 years, I had been doing a 500km return trip at least once a month for the last 18 months so my wife could spend some time with him.

Anyway, went in and saw him at Royal Melbourne. Doctors said he needs a pacemaker (not that big a thing these days) and that he would have to start going to hospital 3 times a week for dialysis. My father in law refused. Beauty.

Go home, get a phone call next morning from mother in law upset at hospital. Go there again. He is still refusing a pacemaker. I confirm with him he is refusing. He confirms. I advise him that he will die without one. He confirms he is aware of that. ####ing great says me.........as I know that I am the only one capable of dealing with this as my mother in law is a mess and my wife upset.

I went and saw the doctor. He must have been at least 23....did not look like he had even started shaving. Advised him of my father in laws wishes, asked for a list of medications he was on and asked what they were for. Told him to stop giving them. He said he will die without them. Yes, I said, and I would also ask that you immediately start him on Morphine. He called a couple of other doctors over, I again stated what I wanted as per my father in laws wishes, he had previously advised them of same.

As per my instructions (my mother in law stated that I was acting for the family) they withdrew his medications. He was in pain, and I demanded Morphine which they gave him. 5 minutes later I asked him if he was in pain, he said yes so I demanded more. And so on. He was unconscious on the third lot.

He died a particularly strange death and not a pleasant one from an observer's point of view. I was given a reason by Doctors, but not a name. Some Googling suggests

My mother in law was with him as I was I and my wife. Waiting for him to die. But he kept on breathing. I had that much Morphine put in him, I couldnt see how he could still be going. So I went and asked for more as my mother in law was becoming distressed. The doctor stated he had been dead for about 10 minutes. I said well, he is still breathing. They said that in some cardiac cases, this can go on for up to 2 hours ! Fark !

I advised my MIL and wife he was in fact dead and had to explain the circumstances. Even though he was dead, doctors refused to declare him dead until he stopped moving. I had to send the others away as it was like watching a fish gasp for water. In the end, I had to sit with him for 80 minutes....the longest 80 minutes of my life. Apart from the gasping, his head kept turning from side to side, like a ghastly laughing clown at Luna Park with eyes, though devoid of life, that were very wide open. In a nutshell, it was horrendous. And another hour with the corpse as they couldnt find a doctor to declare him dead.I barely slept for 3 nights.

My wife has worked in aged care for 10 years, and has never seen or heard of the above. It was just one of those things...a rarity. They also managed to lose the body when the funeral home wanted it....its was not a good time

So should I be Pro Euthanasia ? No. As horrible as it all looked, he wasnt in pain and I carried out what he requested as per his instructions. This is the point, this goes on all the time in Australian hospitals. If you make your wishes known, you can die this way.

I have since found out that you can make what is called a Living Will


I do not want to see Australia become a euthanasia centre for the elderly, the lonely and anyone else like a garbage disposal system. It was also interesting to read that people from failed sex change operations have also been despatched. Sad...given the idiotic gender pushing being done.

[enf]

For the first time in one of these things I put unsure. Whilst I am in favour in principle, I would have to see actual legislation to be sure.....

Certainly, given the intelligence of our politicians (or lack thereof), I have strong doubts that they have the ability to get it right....

[porkop]

The way terminally ill patients are made to suffer is inhuman.

I support it when there is absolutely no cure and death due to the illness is inevitable.

I also do not disagree with those that are suffering extreme mental illness for which treatment is not available and believe me I have see those that are beyond help.

But, in the end of it all, the choice should be only with the person who wishes to die with dignity and without pain and suffering.



I

[mtv]

I'm for it, in the right circumstances.

There are some options, as admin has mentioned.

I would have rather seen the death sentence returned for some serious offences.

[gordon_s1942]

I had been generaly in favour of Euthanasia until an event occurred in my immediate family when a child was seriously ill after having collapsed while in Hospital awaiting for a 'drain' in the Brain to be unclogged.
She had been admitted in a comatose state from the pressure build up from the shunts blockage.
I had only left her in the Hospital some 4 hours before, traveled over a 160kms home to be called back to the hospital and all the way back I had the fear I might be asked to make a critical decision regarding her treatment.
Some will find this hard to accept but I felt a great relief when I found out she had passed away about an hour before we arrived at the hospital.
Now at 75 I am having some respiratory problems that only seem to getting worse and the care I am now needing is increasing and putting a huge amount of work onto my Wife.
I certainly dont want to die just yet but just to exist is not Living and there MUST be Quality to life, not just quantity.

[exited]

Voting yes with the caveat being if suffering is worse than death and it's terminal.

Unfortunately, palliative care has its limits.

[Neddie]

I voted yes, I would like the option to die with dignity if the pain became more than I could bear.

We don't let horses suffer, but at the moment an incurably ill person, in pain, has to drag on, some times for years, and the only legal thing they can do is starve themselves to death, by refusing food. Completely inhumane.

[trash]

Do I support euthanasia?
Sure... let me go and grab my list of names!

[Uncle Fester]

I voted unsure.
There is a very wide grey zone between euthanasia and suicide.
The person suffering may not always be mentally capable of such a decision and a third party is then required to decide weather to convince them to keep fighting or assist in a peaceful end.
I am also not sure if physical pain alone justifies it.
For example in the most radical form, the severing of nerves for can stop pain.
If my head was still OK and the rest of my body is toast but I could still read, watch a sunset, movies, play chess even if somebody has to move the pieces for me, then I would accept this solution.
So the decision should not be alone with the person wishing to die. There may be other solutions, whereas legalised euthanasia could eventually become the norm for a much too quick and easy fix.
There will always cases where there is no other solution but mostly, a person with a death wish will generally not be very open to other solutions, especially when euthanasia is legalised.

[cobra679]

Yes, but on the condition 3 doctors agree to euthanasia for the patient and there is not more then a 50% chance the patient surviving and/or having quality of life 80% of what they had before getting sick. 30 day cooling down period also. If it is a brain injury and the patient has told friends and family that they would rather be dead then being put in a home for the mentally disabled and cant make the choice themselves, then 3 family members and supporting statements from friends should be evaluated on the decision by a judge and medical board. For the depressed patients euthanasia should not be a option only further treatment to help them think clearer and get better. There is enough people killing themselves from depression/stress and don't need any aid to end things.

[mtv]

@ cobra679,

Sorry for OT, but I reckon that's the most sensible, well thought out post I've seen you make in your entire time on Austech.

There may be hope for you yet!

[Tiny]

+1 for cobra679

[gordon_s1942]

I totally agree with the safeguards as suggested by Cobra679 but would like to hear your opinions on this.
Because setting this up could take some time for all the evaluations to take place which could mean the applicant suffering for a long period, once the diagnoses is made of the illness and a general consensus is reached that it is terminal, although it may be several months for the disease to run its course, the process is begun and is evaluated at suitable intervals until it becomes obvious nothing more can be done.
I have had 2 friends die from Pancreatic Cancer recently, one started treatment but found it too grueling and died after some 5 months, the other underwent surgery and I presume Chemo/Radio therapy and lived over 12 months although 'living' is hardly the word I would use to describe his condition in the last weeks of his life.
There will be mistakes made of course but it needs to be discussed by the community in general.

[Neddie]

The protections the Victorian Government have built into the legislation seem pretty comprehensive, only time will tell if they are sufficient or an overkill. (a pun, I guess)

[Tactile]

100% yes.

[lsemmens]

I was in the NT when the Voluntary Euthanasia Law was enacted in 1995. My Eldest sat in parliament for the discussions leading up to the vote. If the safeguards of the NT legislation are in place, then I see it as a good thing. Personally, my religious beliefs would not permit me to take advantage of the law though, if you do not subscribe to them, then that is your prerogative and you should be permitted to do so, if that is your desire. We knew Philip Nitschke and he is a very caring, and compassionate doctor and, for his sake, I am pleased to see that his tireless campaign has finally paid off. The feds cannot overturn a bill passed in a State like they can for their Territories which is downright ridiculous.

FWIW I am more against abortion than I am capital punishment. A baby has NO SAY, a murderer, at least knows the penalty, with Euthanasia, the person has no choice in the matter, he must either suffer, and (eventually) die, or, now, he can choose the time of his demise.

[cobra679]

I totally agree with the safeguards as suggested by Cobra679 but would like to hear your opinions on this.
Because setting this up could take some time for all the evaluations to take place which could mean the applicant suffering for a long period, once the diagnoses is made of the illness and a general consensus is reached that it is terminal, although it may be several months for the disease to run its course, the process is begun and is evaluated at suitable intervals until it becomes obvious nothing more can be done.
I have had 2 friends die from Pancreatic Cancer recently, one started treatment but found it too grueling and died after some 5 months, the other underwent surgery and I presume Chemo/Radio therapy and lived over 12 months although 'living' is hardly the word I would use to describe his condition in the last weeks of his life.
There will be mistakes made of course but it needs to be discussed by the community in general.

The 30 days cooling down period should be how long it takes for all the paper work to be complete and decision on whether to go ahead with Euthanasia. The lawyers will be the one's chasing all this up, organizing, dates for the judge etc. The lawyers will be hired by the government and audited every year to make sure he or her is not committing murder. Tax payers will be paying for the lawyers which is ok with me as you can imagine yourself in the patient shoes

[ol' boy]

I put unsure, even though i do support it and its happened in my immediate family.

Why i say unsure, is i like how it works right now and how its worked for years already.
That is, it happens, its just not legal and nor is it advertised and nor can it be.
But if you are a genuine person with no hope of recovery, only to die a slow and painful death, asking the question of some help will find you with a after hours visit to be given what you need.

Of course, this will only happen after the long and exhausting attempt and treatments and a medical history with said Doctor.

[OSIRUS]

Death is so final there is no taking it back once it has been successfully committed

Just hope no-one has a change of mind after it is done

[fromaron]

Yes with robust procedure in place.