Ban Private Schools

[Neddie]

I've just read an article by Elizabeth Farrelly in the SMH. It makes a lot of sense to me, especially as we are supposed to be a classless society. Why have a system that starts one group of children off believing they are better than the rest. To read the article may be pay-walled so following are some of her points:

The Turnbull government has been caught hiding funding figures for Catholic schools but it beats me why such funding even exists. Indeed, it beats me why private schools exist. Why they're even legal.
Private schools don't necessarily produce bad people, although it's true that (as a 2013 Crikey survey found) most cabinet minsters attended them. Private schools are just very, very bad for the country.
Public money is our money. It's there to fund stuff in which we all believe and from which we all benefit – stuff that makes Australia fairer, more creative, more harmonious, more successful.
We're across it. That's why Peter FitzSimons' petition against Gladys Berejiklian's $2 billion stadium rebuild gathered 150,000 signatures inside a week. "We are tired of taxpayer dollars being lavished on …Sports Big Business while community sport withers on the vine…" wrote FitzSimons. Everyone agrees.
Yet when it's schools withering, we're fine. Every year we pour $53 billion into a system that can only divide us, with a quarter of it – $12.7billion – going straight to educational big business.
And for what? What does it buy, this immense spend? It buys a system that deliberately tribalises children before they can read, that has parents selling their houses for school fees, stressing about homework and entry exams and increasingly investing in private tutoring for four year olds. Yet for all that effort and angst, it's a system that leaves us (as recent news yet again makes clear) less well educated with each passing year.

I believe all children should have the best chance by having the best education, and some schools don't cut the mustard. If those schools were given more resources and specialist teachers for those who need them, the children would be better off. If the extra money that the Government gives to these elite schools were to be added to the money already provided to State Education Departments together with some extra money to cater for the additional numbers of students to be taught, (that could be funded from the tax deductions the rich claim for school fees) all students could be given the same chance, and a better education than many now receive.

To put this in perspective, I went to a State School here in Queensland, but three of my Grandchildren go to a Church run school, my daughter works as a teachers aid at that same school, and my other daughters husband teaches at a Church run school.

I still believe having such things flys in the face of equality of opportunity for all, something I strongly believe in.

[peteramjet]

The largest issue is that the Govt (State and Federal) does not provide enough funding to educate the population - no where near enough.

In NSW in 2016, more than 40% of all secondary students were educated in non-Government schools, yet the Government funding to these schools totaled less than 10%.

The equates to 90% of Govt funding servicing less than 60% of all secondary students.

The other more than 40% of students receive 10% of Govt funding. The remainder is provided by religious and private schools.

The Govt could not educate the other 40% of students without a significant increase in taxes or a large reduction in services elsewhere. Neither of which will happen.

And in regards to equality - it’s a non-argument. Equality means each child has access to education, which each child does. There is a standard curriculum and a standard testing process across all school. It does not mean children can’t access different types of education if they are able to via different schools.

[Uncle Fester]

If our government would stop wasting money in red tape and bureaucracy and start approving tenders that actually are efficient for all government projects, then we would definitely have enough money to fund ALL schools, like it is done in other countries with a better education system than here.

One thing I find far more important though is that ALL schools should be NEUTRAL.
I strongly support an immediate ban on Catholic or any other Religious schools.

Where I live, all private schools are Catholic, so if I wanted my kids to have a "better" education I am forced to let them brainwash my kids.
This should be illegal !!!

Of couse schools are not better simply because they are private over public, it is up to the school itself and the individual teachers, however in my semi-rural area the public secondary schools are pretty substandard.

[DB44]

Sorry, guys, but just typical leftie ranting. All the problems with the school system apparently come down to money, yet for years we have thrown money at public schools only to be rewarded with declining standards of literacy and numeracy and a declining status on the world stage. Throwing more money at schools for no results is not the answer.

It is hardly a surprise that lefties would like to deny parents the right to take their children out of the left-dominated social engineering laboratories which our publlic schools have become. Or even an alternative if their children are not doing well in a public school. Private school parents are, of course, taxpayers to, even though their choice of a private school means they are not getting full value for those taxes.

I find the division argument hypocritical in the extreme. Nothing divides us like identity politics.

Finally, private schools are not perfect. But why does Ms Farrelly think that parents are prepared to make sacrifices to have their children attend private schools? Why is the left's invariable response always to ban and deny people a choice?

Addendum: @nomeat. You made some very good points. Unfortunately, kids are brainwashed just as much in the public school system as in most religious schools. I'm not a fan of Catholic or other religious schools, but I think their existence is the lesser of two evils. Whether public or religious, parents are left to undo the damage of the brainwashing.

[enf]

There is NO reason to assume private schools are better than any other curriculum wise. I spent eight years in the private system and one in the public system. Apart from the religious aspect, and some discipline issues (discipline seems to have largely evaporated universally) I could detect no difference in the quality and type of education. My personal opinion now is that without the discipline of that private school (which I hated) I would have received little or no education because I was just a lazy student. More reliance on maths and the the sciences, and less on social manipulation is needed IMO. But now we have a generation of educational officialdom that is nether capable nor interested in that.

My parents were NOT wealthy and each worked hard and long to put my brother and I through that school.

Was I brainwashed? No, I and all who I knew are atheists or mostly so. From raising six kids in the public system, I find it sad that their seems to be more brainwashing in the public system than in my day. Much of it I managed to correct by teaching my kids to think for themselves rather than just accepting the leftist teachers mantras.

Kids have been granted a plethora of rights by the state. By and large they are the true manifestation of entitlement, and as such are condemned to failure. Parental responsibility has been largely removed, further enhancing a reliance on said state, something that scares the shit out of me.

[lsemmens]

A well educated child will learn to think for themselves and will not be "brainwashed" by any system. It begins at home. Our kids all went to a religious school for their early education and thrived. Owing to circumstances, we had to remove them from that situation and place them within the public system. My daughter (who is violently anti-religion) said it was the worst thing we could have done, although, she understood why. Our eldest was offered a scholarship to remain at that school for his high school years but opted for the public high school because it offered subjects that were more in keeping with his vision for the future. He did well. As Peterramjet has stated, funding for private schools is far outstripped by funding for the public system with little to show for it. Bang for buck, the private system far outperforms the public system. In many ways, the problem isn't so much, money, but, the "do gooders" who dictate the rules of engagement. i.e. you can't smack a recalcitrant child because you will teach them that violence is the answer, you can't fail, Johnny, because it would hurt his feelings...... The good teachers, sadly, get so frustrated trying to comply with such crap that they leave the system to those who couldn't get a job anywhere else. My pet gripe is teachers of any ilk who cannot spell, and have little grasp of the rules of gramma.

[admin]

Sorry, guys, but just typical leftie ranting

Most media articles are these days.

And when we have banned private schools, we could perhaps force everyone to work on collective farms or government owned tractor factories.

[enf]

Most media articles are these days.

And when we have banned private schools, we could perhaps force everyone to work on collective farms or government owned tractor factories.

I know..

We could achieve this with a series of 5 year plans.....

[peteramjet]

One thing I find far more important though is that ALL schools should be NEUTRAL.
I strongly support an immediate ban on Catholic or any other Religious schools.

And what about religious hospitals, which make up a large number of private hospitals? Hospitals that take a large strain off the public health system. Or religious charities that assist the homeless and take the requirement of the Governments to provide these services. Should they all be banned as well?

Unfortunately without the large financial assistance provided by a number of religious organisations, assistance that goes a long way towards providing essential public services, we would all be worse off.

[Neddie]

And what about religious hospitals, ....... Hospitals that take a large strain off the public health system.

They certainly do, however they are run as a revenue generating venture for the sponsoring organisation. Therefor they are an inefficient way of providing health care, and being private they are only available for a section of the community. Not for all

Those people who work at Admins tractor factory can't afford to go there, those who do go there probably have Government subsidised, private health fund coverage. Another inefficient way raise funds for the health system.

However I can hear the cry's now to the suggestion that the Medicare levy be raised and free top standard health care be available to all. After all we are supposed to be a classless society, why not aspire to equal education and health care for all?

[alpha0ne]

I wonder what the $$ cost is of running and administering public schools by a fat bureaucracy equates to, compared to the $$ expended on admin/running costs for private schools ?

How much of that 40 billion is spent on teachers incapable of teaching and the bureaucracy controlling them

[DB44]

They certainly do, however they are run as a revenue generating venture for the sponsoring organisation. Therefor they are an inefficient way of providing health care, and being private they are only available for a section of the community. Not for all

Those people who work at Admins tractor factory can't afford to go there, those who do go there probably have Government subsidised, private health fund coverage. Another inefficient way raise funds for the health system.

However I can hear the cry's now to the suggestion that the Medicare levy be raised and free top standard health care be available to all. After all we are supposed to be a classless society, why not aspire to equal education and health care for all?

Simple economics. Supply and demand. We can't all live in a luxury unit on the beach. There is a finite supply of such units which must be allocated. The current allocation mechanism is money. The mechanism in communist societies is usually ones position in the party, or sheer corruption or both. Such systems have achieved a large measure of equality by way of lowest common denominator care for all but the small elite ruling class. Health care is no different. There are great doctors and terrible ones. The same with hospitals. Despite its drawbacks we are lucky that our health system is as good as it is. But the best doctors and hospitals simply can't treat everyone. They must be allocated somehow.

Your assumption that because private hospitals seek to generate money they are less efficient than public hospitals which are crippled by the amount of bureaucracy amongst other things is shaky at best. Not necessarily inaccurate, but a bold assumption nevertheless apparently based on nothing more than your ideology. Once again, why does the left want to take away choice and reduce everyone to the lowest common denominator? Except of course for their own elites.

[enf]

............................... Once again, why does the left want to take away choice and reduce everyone to the lowest common denominator? Except of course for their own elites.

There in lies the crux of the matter DB44....they can't HELP themselves. Social engineering is what socialists do, because the rest of us NEED to be engineered....

[fromaron]

Surprised she doesn't want to ban private hospitals as well. Oh it will come in the next article?

[mkhannah]

Most media articles are these days.

And when we have banned private schools, we could perhaps force everyone to work on collective farms or government owned tractor factories.

I'd be in. I went to a public school and I love trackters.

[Onefella]

I don't think private schools should be banned. Silly sentiment really. But, I do think private schools should get zero funding from the government.

The government should only pay for government schools. Partial government funding a whole different tier of education seems like madness to me.

[fromaron]

To start with - a disclaimer: My kids always went to public schools.

Private school partial funding helps to keep private schools system alive. That in turn reduces financial burden to public school system.
Stop private schools and government will be forced to expand public sector which will cost taxpayer much more than lefties can imagine.
Everyone will be taxed heavily - rich and poor and then let's see who will complain again.

Another point - rich people who have their kids in private schools also pay taxes (believe it or not) funding public sector. Why can't their kids have a small portion of it?

[DB44]

@fromaron. Very true. Also, there are many parents who are not rich who send their children to private schools. Even the expensive elite private schools have parents who struggle and have to make enormous sacrifices to send their children.

[admin]

I don't think private schools should be banned. Silly sentiment really. But, I do think private schools should get zero funding from the government.

The government should only pay for government schools. Partial government funding a whole different tier of education seems like madness to me.

So pray tell.....when we take the partial government funding from private schools, and that then makes the private schools so expensive so that only the ultra rich can afford them, how do we finance all these new schools ? Raise the medicare levy ? Tax the good old worker even more ? Or force the cost on business, who of course have nothing to do with it at all by raising company tax so we can go even better than third highest in the world ?

Many normal not particularly wealthy people work overtime to send their children to private schools simply because there is less bullshit and better education at them. If my children (adults) were young in this current age and environment, I would be sacrificing something to send them to one. Public schools are now loaded to the roof with almost all women (men have basically given up teaching....I wonder why ?) and almost all run a left wing agenda and unfortunately try and instill it in those they teach. Some deliberately, some perhaps don't realise they do it. Regardless, the vast majority of teachers that are coming out of university have leftist tenancies, certainly you would be scratching to find a right wing teacher these days in the public system.

A mate of mine recently told me his grandson who is I 8 came home from school talking about Trump because his teacher made comments about him in the classroom. Seriously ?

Of course you can also have child programmed in radical gender theory free of charge in the public system as well, what a bonus.

[trash]

Having been to both private and public schools, I can safely say that you're not getting good value for money when it comes to private schools.

I would like to think we live in a meritocracy where intelligence and hard work are rewarded. Mahahahahahaha.
Private schools look better for one very simple reason. They can ignore the idiots and selectively remove anybody who is seriously under performing.
If your kid is lagging behind the Down Syndrome kids on his marks. He might just have trouble learning, he's a quiet and good kid. He won't last 1 year in a private school because he'll need "specialist" education that this school doesn't offer. Bye, don't let the door hit you on the way out !

Private schools game their performance by raising their average IQ by removing idiots, not by making everybody smarter.
The advantage they do offer is that there few unintelligent morons dragging a class down with disruptive behaviour.
But this also selects for more intelligent disruptive morons. Less petty thugs, more sophisticated psychopaths.

One thing I have noticed is that smart kids generally tend to come from smart parents.
By we know intelligence is not genetic. So what does this tell you about the education system?

It doesn't make you smart. It provides a means to get smarter. It also provides an opportunity for the proletarians to impede the intellectual progression of society as a whole on multiple levels.