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Thread: Scanning police

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    Default Scanning police

    Just spent 4 days at Batemans Bay (pass Nowra) and scanned the old Sydney police channels while waiting for the wife, and found they are still operational on 468mhz analogue. I didn't know that there were still areas on analogue in the 468mhz range.



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    Premium Member puca's Avatar
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    yes wagga and goulburn region are still analogue as well as dubbo most of country nsw for that matter
    IF IT DONT WORK USE A BIGGER HAMMER

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    also north of newcastle to the boarder is still analogue.

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    I spent 7 days at Byron Bay just on 4 weeks ago and I never thought to scan for police while there. I thought all the state was digital encrypted. Thanks guys, I'll keep this in mind when I next travel.
    Cheers

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    You will find that most of the country areas are still analogue.Vicpol country regions (P1,P2 etc) are on VHF.


    Chris
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    Yeah Chris, I thought all the country channels were on 72 mhz, thats why I was surprised when I heard them on 468mhz.

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    Pretty much all of country NSW still uses UHF analog.
    They also use VHF high band analog and HF analog.

    Just do a search on the AMCA database for "VKG" for NSW.

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    Trash - Q for you mate.

    Any chance of listening to the digital version of police radio?
    I know that south of me is all digital - North of me is all analogue (Port Stephens, Maitland, Upper Hunter, Taree)

    I also know it's encrypted. I'm not sure what with.
    Have you heard of any inroads for tapping in?
    Reality is an invention of my imagination.
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    I know around Nelsons bay and Raymond Terrace is clear Digital, which you can listen to with any digital scanner(e.g Uniden 396t)

    But south of that is digital and encryption,
    I would say this also applys in and around Newcastle.

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    One thing with their analogue transmissions is that they must not be able to use the in car display (DDU?), as I heard license checks etc. I suppose the in car display is only available with digital.

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    Quote Originally Posted by astro_boy View Post
    I know around Nelsons bay and Raymond Terrace is clear Digital, which you can listen to with any digital scanner(e.g Uniden 396t)

    But south of that is digital and encryption,
    I would say this also applys in and around Newcastle.
    After the police went "digital" in Tas i turned off my old scanner and purchased a uniden 396t 12 months later i programmed the 800Mz police freqs into my old scanner and can still hear them , my point is i thought the encryption/digital was the same thing they can turn it on or off

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dale View Post
    After the police went "digital" in Tas i turned off my old scanner and purchased a uniden 396t 12 months later i programmed the 800Mz police freqs into my old scanner and can still hear them , my point is i thought the encryption/digital was the same thing they can turn it on or off
    "Is your radio secure?"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fernbay View Post
    "Is your radio secure?"
    dont know, another person sent me a file and i programmed it in scanner everything works , my old scanner is a Realistic 200 channel something
    Last edited by Dale; 02-05-09 at 10:12 PM. Reason: add

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    unless there has be some major changes to the radcom act, it's not illegal to receive anything except "services interconnected to the telecommunications network." This primarly means phones and to a lesser extent pagers. In theory it should cover internet too but it's always been a bit of a gray area and for most purposes it hasn't been considered as such.

    Nothing wrong with listening to the police in analog or digital even if it is encrypted.

    The subject of the encryption and the options for defeating it are straight forward, but out of my reach.

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    Nobody has been able to crack the digital encryption yet and unlikely to.

    The system requires a 'handshake' from the 'authorised' mobile radio's when they are turned on, before receiving new keys which are required to be loaded in the radio before it can transmit or receive comms.

    If a radio is lost or stolen, it can be remotely stunned or killed, rendering it useless to anyone, other than the department who owns it.

    The MDU (Mobile Data Unit) is a separate system to the comms radio and operates independent to the radio, but also requires the handshake and keys before it's functional.

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    i know that the cops, in the technical department do employ encryptologists.
    a friend likes to listen to the train drivers on his scanner, he reckons the action is there in bucket loads.
    iam a bogan

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    What type of action? And what frequency?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mate View Post
    i know that the cops, in the technical department do employ encryptologists.
    a friend likes to listen to the train drivers on his scanner, he reckons the action is there in bucket loads.

    Sounds good,

    Got any feq's ??

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    I picked up on ozzyjim's post in the other thread and figured I'd respond here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzyjim View Post
    DES (a form of it) is probalbly the answer but does anybody KNOW for SURE.
    I'm unsure as I haven't paid a lot of attention to it. I know they can use DES, but I'm not sure if they decided on RC4.
    In NSW the state politicians are either corrupt or stupid or both. They went with the Motorola system probably because they offered the best junket trips to see their system in action. So anything you want to know about the system, the first place to look is Motorola.

    There is a whole family of radios that can be used. The XTS3000 is the model the NSW police use. There are cheaper radios like the Sabres that can also be used. It's best to check if they have their APCO25 boards or capability.
    The encryption boards can also be bought of ebay for a not too expensive price.

    Has there been any attempts at de-crypting the audio streams?. I know that given the number of keys available in DES it would be unlikely that somebody would stumble upon the key by testing them out,
    The MWT (monkeys with typwriters) approach.

    SETI@home uses this kind of approach.
    The method of doing it is to find a source of cheap radios and crypto boards, not just for yourself, but for everybody.
    Since these radios are not in their asset list, they cannot be forcibly shut down. The onus of security is as it should be, on the police themselves.

    Lets assume a single 128 bit key is used. It's going to take a very long time to brute force and run all the combinations. Given the itinerant nature of the radio traffic, it's not going to be a very successful method. It's more likely a key change will occur long before a complete run is completed.

    But, if the task is shared, then the job can be completed in a much quicker time. If two people are working from opposite ends of the key, then the task is completed in t(1/n). Where t is the time take for one person to run all the keys and n is the number of people trying.
    The law of dimishing returns starts to kick in and double the number of people is required for each halving of time. It still doesn't take the itinerant nature of the communications stream out of the equation.

    The method around this is to capture the base band date stream before it enters the crypto board, and then run the same stream into the crypto board repeatitvely while changing the key. The process is much faster and even if the key is changed in the real world, it will give the user a chance to jump on their coat tails.
    In the real world, all cypher streams are recorded. The information they contain may be out of date, but each transmission partially betrays the key.
    If the key is never changed, then it's only a matter of time before it is broken.

    If the key is changed "in band" (over the air) using the previous key, then this will be captured in any recorded streams. It provides a short cut to future key changes. If the key is charged predictably, then this is almost handing the keys to the cryptoanalysist.

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    type of action..... jumpers, graffiti, vandalism, fights on trains, car accidents and all the usual communication between drivers and control centers.
    iam a bogan

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