Results 1 to 11 of 11

Thread: Separation of power and data - Wiring Rules

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    56
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    138
    Reputation
    60

    Default Separation of power and data - Wiring Rules

    I'll put this one out there for some comments..... We're about to install a structured data network for a retrofit. Almost all of the walls are partition or concrete, so cabling will be mostly surface work. The sparky is happy to put in all of the duct work from the ceiling cavity down to the mounting blocks whilst he does so for power. We will rough in, terminate and test all data points (as the registered cabling provider). He has suggested using segregated duct. From a compliance perspective, I don't have an issue there as there is a physical barrier (albeit a useless 2mm plastic one) between power and data shared in the segregated duct.

    My conundrum - when power and data exit the bottom of the duct, there will have to be a small overlap as one passes behind the other behind the first mounting block (if positioned side by side). I'm being purposely finicky with compliance, but interested if any other registered cablers out there can suggest a good solution. We normally run all of our own duct or conduit, but in this case it makes sense for him to install them whilst he is doing so for the power. If the mounting blocks are not placed either side of the bottom of the duct, either power or data will have to crossover in the first mounting block. Your best practice ideas would be welcome.

    Cheers

    James



Look Here ->
  • #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    463
    Thanks
    235
    Thanked 183 Times in 114 Posts
    Rep Power
    261
    Reputation
    2421

    Default

    glue a small piece of plastic between the two, or a small piece of flex.
    Last edited by vnboost; 22-06-14 at 08:39 PM.

  • #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    56
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    138
    Reputation
    60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vnboost View Post
    glue a small piece of plastic between the two, or a small piece of flex.
    Thanks vnboost, however that will only work if the data and power outlets are placed either side of the bottom of the duct. The customer wants outlets close to the corner of the room, which would mean duct has to be set in and run down the wall around 200mm from the corner which is unsightly. Our sparky will want to run his duct down the corner of each room and thus the issue - duct down the corner and two outlets (1 x power, 1 x data) side by side with duct running into the top of the first. Once power and data exit the bottom of the duct, either the power or data has to cross behind the first outlet inside its mounting block to get to the mounting block next to it. It's pedantic, but I know other cablers must have addressed this issue and technically power or data running through the other's enclosure or mounting block is against the wiring rules. There has to be a 150mm separation at the termination point or hard insulating barrier. Segregated duct is made for a reason, so there must be a logical solution.....

  • #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    463
    Thanks
    235
    Thanked 183 Times in 114 Posts
    Rep Power
    261
    Reputation
    2421

    Default

    tough one, i have never had to deal with that type of install before, personally if i cant achieve the required separation or be able to put an insulating barrier in between i wouldn't touch the job.

  • The Following User Says Thank You to vnboost For This Useful Post:

    tristen (22-06-14)

  • #5
    LSemmens
    lsemmens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Rural South OZ
    Posts
    10,585
    Thanks
    11,867
    Thanked 7,060 Times in 3,338 Posts
    Rep Power
    3153
    Reputation
    132572

    Default

    Back, last century, prior to Cabling licensing etc, we just had to ensure adequate separation from power. You could cross over at right angles using a conduit or the like but the big no-no was running the stuff closely in parallel to mains cable i.e not in the same channel. (I'm only talking telephony here, and I was responsible for acceptance testing on new buildings). Haven't been near it since the 1980s, though. You should be able to cross power with little difficulty provided some decent form of separation is used (conduit, or the like). I'm not sure what the rules are now. The main reason for isolating long parallel runs wasn't so much the electrickery, but the induction hum caused on the line, data was especially sensitive to it back then.

  • #6
    Premium Member
    ol' boy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    17,662
    Thanks
    8,131
    Thanked 10,460 Times in 5,194 Posts
    Rep Power
    4471
    Reputation
    184272

    Default

    Run your own trunking solution.
    Do not use Split Ducting.
    Keep 200mm away.

    Segregated Ducting is made for a reason, for AS3000.
    Last edited by ol' boy; 23-06-14 at 06:14 AM.

  • #7
    Administrator
    mtv's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    19,893
    Thanks
    7,508
    Thanked 15,066 Times in 6,761 Posts
    Rep Power
    5647
    Reputation
    239305

    Default

    I also prefer not using anything that results in close parallel runs of power & data/signal, for inductive-interference reasons.

    In your situation, instead of mounting the outlets side by side, mount them one on top of the other.

    That way cables can exit the ducting from the side without crossing each other.

    Eg: the top outlet takes the cable from the closest side of the ducting, whilst the cable in the other side of the ducting continues down the ducting then crosses below the first cable for the second outlet, maintaining the 50mm separation.

    If your client must have outlets laid out horizontally, then install them in segregated skirting. This method would maintain the mandatory separation.

  • The Following User Says Thank You to mtv For This Useful Post:

    tristen (24-06-14)

  • #8
    Premium Member
    ol' boy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    17,662
    Thanks
    8,131
    Thanked 10,460 Times in 5,194 Posts
    Rep Power
    4471
    Reputation
    184272

    Default

    Clients soon get over Visual cabling, when their PoS systems don't talk to each other.
    You as a Data Contractor will also save yourself future fault finding visits at No Expense to the Client, but to you.

  • #9
    Senior Member
    weirdo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    5,458
    Thanks
    4,638
    Thanked 3,135 Times in 1,633 Posts
    Rep Power
    0
    Reputation
    29602

    Default

    Is dedicated Wifi an option?

  • #10
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    56
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
    Rep Power
    138
    Reputation
    60

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by oceanboy View Post
    Run your own trunking solution.
    Do not use Split Ducting.
    Keep 200mm away.

    Segregated Ducting is made for a reason, for AS3000.
    Hey Oceanboy, yep this is pretty much where I got to with it. Ultimately their desire for aesthetics will have to be outweighed with protection of our data network from induction of EMI and compliance with regs. Spoke to the sparky today and we're going to put in separate duct work for our cabling. All just too tight and as I originally said, the 2mm internal plastic barrier in internal duct will do nothing more than appease the regs but won't protect our cabling.

    Thanks everyone for their 2c worth.

    Cheers

    James

  • #11
    Administrator
    mtv's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    19,893
    Thanks
    7,508
    Thanked 15,066 Times in 6,761 Posts
    Rep Power
    5647
    Reputation
    239305

    Default

    It appears we just confirmed what you already decided was best.

  • Bookmarks

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •