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Thread: Turnbulls FTTN

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    I realize that the people who were championing Turnbulls' nbn would never open this thread now, BUT here is more, what frigging governments we have, bring back Genghis Khan
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    That article sums it all up very well.

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    I just shake my head these days when ppl tell me how dumb the septics are when it comes to politics/media saturation/LIES........................

    What has happened in this once great country these last few years makes me hope my grandchildren leave this country ............................for.................da re I say it............................NZ

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    We normally compare our selves to Canada, appears that they regard high nbn speeds as essential
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    ^ But but but so does our political masters......................thats why they are laying down $$$$ millions of brand new copper wire, after pulling up the old wire

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    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    Everyone should have nbn by 2016
    , Son, who lives in the big smoke may have it this week. I'm still waiting.
    I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message...

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    I have plagerised this article from Whirlpool, so hope that does not contravene the rules, but i think this guy has summerised a lot of peoples complaints, being mainly directed at the RSP


    reply short code
    posted 25 minutes ago

    Hi Monsh I'm also Wodonga based & a long time reader of Whirpool & first time poster. My circumstances are similiar to yours in relation to my cutover to the NBN on Friday. I actually have an IT back ground & can shed more light on what's going on in Wodonga Re: NBN cutovers. I am the 35th person to be cut over to the FTTN node on the corner of Ware Ave & Marshall street. I was due to be cutover from the old Telstra pillar across the road from the node last Wednesday. However whoever was charged with doing the cutover stuffed it up and switched someone elses copper pair across to the node!! So someone else must have been complaining about losing their phone service. An NBN Co. Tech was booked in by my RSP (Optus) to sort it out as they thought it may have been an issue at my house. Fortunately he was a very experienced Tech who was able to identify & sort issue out fairly quickly. He also took the opportunity to fully optimise my line by running all the line checks & doing the required attenuations to give me solid (best) connection sync rate. He showed me how he was getting a solid 107 Mbps upstream & 42 Mbps downstream reading for my line at the FTTN node. Now given that I'm ~480m from the node I was aware that VDSL2 degrades fairly quickly when you get beyond 500m from the node (lucky for those that are close to the node). The Tech then came back to my house & we checked the modem sync stats (you need to log on to modem & check teh stats page for this data). They were and have remained constant 76/35 Mbps rock solid!! So no question that line connection for me is spot on. If you look up the published charts for VDSL2 v distance from node my modem sync results are spot on. So whilst I'm on an 100\40 Mbps plan, my hardware (which is the Sagecom Optus supplied VDSL modem) is only going to deliver a max. 76/35 Mbps due to signal degregration over teh 480m of copper to my modem.

    Now he's the kicker. Whilst I can in theory achieve 76/35 Mbps, like you I was getting down to 2 3 Mbps in peak time & 72Mbps in the late hours of the night (As measured on the optus singtel speed checker. NB: The modem sync speeds are still perfect). Now given that I run a home based business & have done so for the last 15+ years this situation has really upset the applecart & I'm actually quite furious with the whole deal with moving over to this substandard 3rd world setup. For the last 6 years or so I have enjoyed a rock solid 15\1 mbps ADSL2+ connection via the West wodonga exchange. It's been brilliant & served my business needs well. You can imagine the predicament I'm in now, where I have significant adverse impacts on my livelihood.

    Okay so what have I been doing to rectify this dire situation. When it became obvious that there was something seriuosly wrong at my RSP's end, I rang Tech suopport for an explanation. They assured me late Friday that there was a general outage in Victoria, so don't worry give me your mobile # & we'll text you back when it's fixed. Well of course this was just BS. There was no outage & no text ever came. So I rang back Saturday (yesterday) for further explanation & this time I was told that Optus is aware of the issue in Wodonga & is working on resolving it. I asked for an ETA given the business criticality for me & this is when they really got my back up!! They indicated that it could be days, it could be months as they had to increase their bandwidth allowance which really means that they just haven't purchased enough CVC allowance from NBN Co.. In practical terms what this means is that every one that is with Optus (or any other RSP that hasn't purchased enough CVC allowance) that is on our shared node will have their speeds throttled back based on the number of their users that are simultaneously using the node. What a joke!! When I asked the NBN Co. Tech, out of curiosity, as to how many residents had cut over to my node since it became operational 6 weeks ago, he mentioned that I was the 35th & that the connection card that I was on had capacity for 45 so another 10 connections to further slow down our connections if our RSP's don't increase their CVC's!!! NB I didn't ask how many cards are going into this node, but looking at the NBN provisioning info it could eventually be servicing ~1000 homes. Apparently NBN co. have made the 45users / card a design feature to minimise congestion through the node (He indicated the previous issues with Telstra DSLAM's congestion was that there were 128 connections per card).

    I seriously want my ADSL2+ connection back!! How can we accept that this is progress. Govt / NBN Co. has really stuffed this up & I've now been educating myself around the pricing structures that NBN Co. are forcing down the RSP's collective throats. In a nutshell the current pricing structures make it economically difficult for RSP's to purchase extra CVC's. It's not a good situation & needs to be sorted big time. Apart from the potential political fallout that will inevitably come, Australians have been duped into a substandard technology & rollout. As a nation we are likely to pay in terms of our competitiveness as we continue to slide down the ladder of IT infrastructure quality. This is business critical for me. I purcahsed a premium plan from Optus ( It was a premium business plan where they indicated that they'd give me Tier 3 or 4 connectivity) & they are now telling me that they can't deliver & don't know when they will be able to deliver I'm not a lawyer but I think that there's some major contraventions of consumer law here. How can RSP's advertise & sign people up to products that they can't deliver on. Suspect that the ACCC needs to step in here. It would appear that I'm not Robinson crusoe with the experience I'm going through.

    In my last very frustrated dialogue with Optus Tech support they have offered to release me from my contract they now understand the gravity of my situation & their allowing me to transition to an alternate RSP. They even said that I can keep all the hardware they sent me for free. My fear is that most RSP's are in the same boat given what you've said about your Telstra experience. I'll keep you posted on what eventuates. It has now become a priority for me to sort. I shouldn't have to be wasting my precious time sorting this BS out!!! BTW it appears that if you are one of the lucky people to have FTTP (i.e. fibre all the way to your modem) you get a guaranteed performance KPI on data speed from your RSP & NBN Co.!! Clearly Govt. \ NBN Co. have set up for some serious inequities here. Those of us that only have the compulsory option of an FTTN cut over pay the same price for our service as those Taxpayers who have FTTP. Yet they get premium delivery whilst we lanquish with crappy outcomes. To be continued...
    Last edited by allover; 12-02-17 at 01:26 PM.
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    Quote Originally Posted by allover View Post
    I have plagerised this article from Whirlpool, so hope that does not contravene the rules, but i think this guy has summerised a lot of peoples complaints, being mainly directed at the RSP...
    First off, let me say, I'm definitely pro FTTP, I think it makes a lot more sense to spend a little more now, and have a network that will be viable for the next century, not just the next decade like FTTN.


    I seriously want my ADSL2+ connection back!! How can we accept that this is progress. Govt / NBN Co. has really stuffed this up & I've now been educating myself around the pricing structures that NBN Co. are forcing down the RSP's collective throats. In a nutshell the current pricing structures make it economically difficult for RSP's to purchase extra CVC's. It's not a good situation & needs to be sorted big time. Apart from the potential political fallout that will inevitably come, Australians have been duped into a substandard technology & rollout. As a nation we are likely to pay in terms of our competitiveness as we continue to slide down the ladder of IT infrastructure quality.
    CVC pricing was set under a Labor government, and has actually been slightly lowered while the LNP have been in power.


    BTW it appears that if you are one of the lucky people to have FTTP (i.e. fibre all the way to your modem) you get a guaranteed performance KPI on data speed from your RSP & NBN Co.!! Clearly Govt. \ NBN Co. have set up for some serious inequities here. Those of us that only have the compulsory option of an FTTN cut over pay the same price for our service as those Taxpayers who have FTTP. Yet they get premium delivery whilst we lanquish with crappy outcomes. To be continued...
    That is incorrect, FTTP, FTTN, or Fixed Wireless, are all at the mercy of the ISP's CVC capacity. While on FTTP you are guaranteed a 100Mbps connection, come peak times, you'll see the same slow to a crawl speeds that everyone else does if your ISP has CVC capacity problems.


    I've had a FTTN connection with Internode for nearly a year now, located 530m from the node and sync @ 82-27 Mbps.
    My speed tests have looked like this 24/7 for the last several months.



    Twice, back when I was first connected, Internode had CVC capacity problems on my POI, and both times it was like pulling teeth getting them to fix it, but both times they fixed it within a couple of weeks.

    I don't see why people feel the need to stretch the truth when it comes to FTTP vs FTTN, the fact speak for themselves, $50 billion + should buy you a network that will last longer then 10 years.




    Last edited by Tech4U; 12-02-17 at 03:28 PM.

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    So i live on a main street with business eg bunnings and others across my street on top of the shopping center does that mean i will be on crawl speeds all day long if my isp doesn't purchase? If so i'm with the dude on whirlpool and just want to stay where im on 7 mbps which works just fine and no slowing down in peak times.
    You also state that labour brought in the cvc pricing and also state on 100mbps connection you are guaranteed that which with labours fttp all would have gotten.
    I'm not tech savy like you but from all reports and forum reading this whole thing is a mess which no one knows how the fix unless your a liberal that is cause they know best.
    50 bill plus you would hope it lasts longer than what the copper has lasted which is still going strong apparently so why we changing from copper to copper?
    Anyway may the force be with us as with the MH attack i had 2 months ago i might not live to see this mess come to fruition in my case anyway.

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    And here we go, Murdoch press has discovered that a second rate system equals a second rate service, along with a few other articles being critical of Liberals in the last week, has Rupert changed sides? note that Rups brother in law is saying that there is no guarantee Vic Liberals will be getting their $400,000 dollar donation this year either!
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    Quote Originally Posted by levend View Post
    You also state that labour brought in the cvc pricing and also state on 100mbps connection you are guaranteed that which with labours fttp all would have gotten.
    There is a difference between connection speed, and download speed.

    On FTTP if you pay for a 100mbps connection, you will get a 100mbps connection.
    On FTTN if you pay for a 100mbps connection, you will get anywhere from 25mbps to 100mbps connection (We'll ignore the lower coexistence speeds at this point to make things simpler).

    But both the FTTP and FTTN connections, will have the same limited download speed once the RSP's CVC capacity is reached.


    Quote Originally Posted by allover View Post
    And here we go, Murdoch press has discovered that a second rate system equals a second rate service
    It's been disgusting that the main stream media have not jumped all over this issue, the largest infrastructure project in Australia's history, is having decisions made that make absolutely no sense from a technical point of view, yet we hear no criticism from the media.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech4U View Post
    It's been disgusting that the main stream media have not jumped all over this issue, the largest infrastructure project in Australia's history, is having decisions made that make absolutely no sense from a technical point of view, yet we hear no criticism from the media.
    Nor Labor!
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    Quote Originally Posted by allover View Post
    Nor Labor!
    Well labour said they would reinstall the proper internet and people didn't vote them in now we all suffer. I'm hoping bu june when the nbn starts our area things might change otherwise i might hold of till deadline.
    Do you know when the boxes in the street go up? I know all the cables are done but i can't see boxes anywhere near.

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    You may be one of the lucky ones getting FTTP
    There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"

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    Quote Originally Posted by levend View Post
    Well labour said they would reinstall the proper internet and people didn't vote them in now we all suffer.
    For most people the NBN is not an issue that sways them one way or another. There are far more important issues that sway them when they cast their vote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by peteramjet View Post
    For most people the NBN is not an issue that sways them one way or another. There are far more important issues that sway them when they cast their vote.
    Yes i know that but i'm just keeping to the one that belongs in here and that is the nbn and what it has become.
    Politically i don't really give a rats arse as one is as good as the other.
    In this case we had one group saying we want to future proof for the future and the other saying no we don't we can do it cheaper smarter cheaper (yeah right) Now they are saying Australians don't want fast internet.
    Reminds me when i wanted the adsl put it i go to bendigo telstra and optus shop to compare and all i got sorry the net is slow today won't be long lol I thought wtf they don't give a shit about there own business what are they like with the public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by levend View Post
    In this case we had one group saying we want to future proof for the future and the other saying no we don't we can do it cheaper smarter cheaper (yeah right) Now they are saying Australians don't want fast internet.
    Not true.

    One mob said they would build a network, and when they started to do so realised there was no proper planning or preparation, fell well behind schedule and went well above cost, then admitted (via their then Communications Minister) that the proposed network was never going to be built or have the reach the way they promised.

    The other mob took over, realised the build was indeed behind scedule and well above cost, changed to a mixed type to save money, yet failed to do so and will now likely still not build the network as promised.

    Either way there was no guarantee under either mob that a good network was ever going to be built. It was a political stunt - by both parties - not a chance to actually 'future proof' the nation.

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  • #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by peteramjet View Post
    Not true.

    One mob said they would build a network, and when they started to do so realised there was no proper planning or preparation, fell well behind schedule and went well above cost, then admitted (via their then Communications Minister) that the proposed network was never going to be built or have the reach the way they promised.

    The other mob took over, realised the build was indeed behind scedule and well above cost, changed to a mixed type to save money, yet failed to do so and will now likely still not build the network as promised.

    Either way there was no guarantee under either mob that a good network was ever going to be built. It was a political stunt - by both parties - not a chance to actually 'future proof' the nation.
    So one wasn't prepared properly and the other dgaf.

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    Quote Originally Posted by levend View Post
    So one wasn't prepared properly and the other dgaf.
    Yep, essentially. Couldn't have put it better myself

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