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Thread: Automatic Transfer Switch / Generator Starter

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    Default Automatic Transfer Switch / Generator Starter

    Does anyone know if such a device is available here in Australia ?

    I want to set up a backup generator for when there is a blackout, so I need to automatically start the generator ( which has electric start ) and isolate from the grid until power is restored to normal and then stop generator.
    The house is only single phase.

    Have seen a couple of these things around for swithing from inverter to generator as used in boats etc but nothing I cant find anything for Generator / mains switching .



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    Premium Member rob916's Avatar
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    You should be able to do this with contactors.
    What happens if I press alt + F4?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rob916 View Post
    You should be able to do this with contactors.
    Yeah I could make my own using a large DPDT relay with 240 coil and small timer circuit to trigger generator but this wont be approved and will void house insurance if there is ever an electrical fire , electrocution etc .

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    Premium Member rob916's Avatar
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    Let me rephrase, A licensed sparky should be able to do this with contactors for you.
    Search for backup generator control module.
    or this at the bottom of page.
    What happens if I press alt + F4?

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    Senior Member BCNZ's Avatar
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    You can easily make a unit that will start a generator using contactors, but there's more to starting a generator than just operating the starter motor. There are various things to consider, plus the issue of mains change-over.

    The change-over needs a delay on it, so that when mains returns, the system doesn't snap back to the mains immediately.
    It also needs to be able to sense that the generator is delivering stable voltage and frequency before it changes to it.

    The system needs to know that the engine has started, and what to do if it doesn't.
    It needs to be able to shut the engine down once mains has returned and the appropriate delay has timed out.
    There also needs to be monitoring of engine temp, oil pressure, over and under-voltage of the genset and more.
    This is why proper genset control units are used as they have all these functions built in. Have a look on Ebay - I'm sure I have seen them on there.

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    Senior Member cwispy's Avatar
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    These guys may be able to do what you want.

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    http://www.2000cn.com.au/shadowprotect.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Studio1 View Post
    You can easily make a unit that will start a generator using contactors, but there's more to starting a generator than just operating the starter motor. There are various things to consider, plus the issue of mains change-over.

    The change-over needs a delay on it, so that when mains returns, the system doesn't snap back to the mains immediately.
    It also needs to be able to sense that the generator is delivering stable voltage and frequency before it changes to it.

    The system needs to know that the engine has started, and what to do if it doesn't.
    It needs to be able to shut the engine down once mains has returned and the appropriate delay has timed out.
    There also needs to be monitoring of engine temp, oil pressure, over and under-voltage of the genset and more.
    This is why proper genset control units are used as they have all these functions built in. Have a look on Ebay - I'm sure I have seen them on there.
    Thanks for the reply mate , I am aware that there needs to be delays etc , hence the question seeking a pre-made unit .
    I have looked at the link Rob provided and these units are for Marine use , contactors are only low current not suitable for switching home mains power.

    I have tried and searched until my finger are almost worn out and cant find anything on eBay or available in Australia that can be simply purchased and connected up by a sparky .
    Heaps of information saying what you need but virtually nothing with the units themselves , countless pages saying you need an Automatic transfer switch or generator control unit , automatic gen starter , you name it there stuff written everywhere but where the hell are any of these units for sale?

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    Senior Member cwispy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey View Post
    Heaps of information saying what you need but virtually nothing with the units themselves , countless pages saying you need an Automatic transfer switch or generator control unit , automatic gen starter , you name it there stuff written everywhere but where the hell are any of these units for sale?


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    Quote Originally Posted by cwispy View Post
    These guys may be able to do what you want.

    Have seen these already " Complies with Marine & Mobile Wiring Standards" they dont have a generator starter and will only handle 40amps , would need to be 80amp of higher contactors to start with .
    The average single phase main switch is 80amp

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    Try contacting someone like this then.



    The standby gensets I have had experience with, such as the ones in the radio transmission sites, just have a contact point for the ATS. It simply throws a contact and then genset handles its own startup and turning on the output power when its up to speed, then the ATS switches to that power feed when its stable.
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    Senior Member z80's Avatar
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    What's the total power requirement of the generator?

    Is money an issue?

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    Quote Originally Posted by z80 View Post
    What's the total power requirement of the generator?

    Is money an issue?
    Only 4KVA continuous , money isnt an issue for the correct system .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey View Post
    Only 4KVA continuous
    4kVA @ 240 Volts is only 16.6 Amps... Correct??

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gitch View Post
    4kVA @ 240 Volts is only 16.6 Amps... Correct??

    Thats correct , but the contactors have to switch back over to normal mains load which is much higher if running bore pump , electric stove , R/C Aircon etc
    Handling the Generator load is not a problem.

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    Have a look at these, specifically the 300SE



    They are part of Emerson Network Power. It would appear that they have all the gear your looking for.

    Edit, look at the lower ones too. I didnt notice they also have generator control. The 300's are 3 phase.
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    Another link to GEC asia pacifics site, but it does not have a lot of details

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    Senior Member z80's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joey View Post
    Thats correct , but the contactors have to switch back over to normal mains load which is much higher if running bore pump , electric stove , R/C Aircon etc
    Handling the Generator load is not a problem.

    McFarlane generators in Clayton Victoria.


    They can point you in the right direction.





    They have a calculator tool for sizing as well.


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    Smile

    We use one from here

    200 HP diesel/3 phase generator/100 bed hospital.
    Auto switchover, controls 2 contactors, opens the mains supply one, starts engine then closes generator contactor and power available in under 8 seconds, All legal and approved (Not cheap though)

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