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Thread: Is Inner Ranges Inception a step forward or back?

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    Default Is Inner Ranges Inception a step forward or back?

    Ok so I have been with my new company with about 6 months now and the boss has been getting me to install the Concept 4K everywhere.
    The system seems clunky, over complicated and very un-user friendly.

    I finally persuaded him to get away from the Concept and to try the Inception. I installed one on a private job (that he knew about) fast, streamlined, a breeze to install/program and the post install IP login is a godsend! Everything was great.
    So I told the boss how great it was and he immediately told me he wants to use the Integriti on a large upcoming job!
    He has never used the integriti, I have never used it and we got a "training panel" on loan that seems to be doing nothing but confusing me!
    The majority of jobs we do are large 30+ zones with 2/4 access control doors and we remotely arm/disarm.

    Can anyone tell me the ups and downs of these systems? Because as far as I can see the Inception does everything that the Concept and the Integriti do but does it better. Am I missing something? Apart from the base Inception only having 8 zones vs the Concept/Integriti having 16?

    Somebody please help me out as I'm pulling my hair out here!



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    Hi Fado,

    The Inception is really a great little unit, packing a lot of punch for a single panel and web based setup makes it a breeze to program.

    Concept 4000 is 20+ year old tech (the first boards are old enough to drink in the US), which at the time provided revolutionary degree of flexibility on an 8 bit processor and the most complex and powerful keypad editing system ever conceived by man, however 1998 called, they want their panel back.

    In this day and age, there is no reason to install one on a Green-fields site. However, there are plenty of concept sites which expand and require the installation of additional controllers.

    Integriti, Inner Range's current flagship product isn't really understandable unless you are using the software, and are thinking of systems which span multiple panels, all linked to the server via IP.

    So in answer to your question regarding whether to use Integriti or Inception, the question really comes down to this. Will the site ever expand to require more than one inception panel? And are any of the features of the Integriti software required by the end user? if either of those are true, then Integriti is the way to go. It is more powerful and is the only way to handle multi-controller installations with IR gear.

    In my experience, programming Integriti from the software is a fairly logical process, and (not knowing what you've got) is AFAIK impossible to program completely from the keypad.

    The other giveaway that Inception will probably be the best choice for you is that you think 30+ zones and < 10 access doors is a large job. Whilst you can use Integriti for job of that size, it is really built for jobs with hundreds to thousands or doors, users, zones, etc. And really only shines when you're using more than one panel and have a dedicated server.
    Last edited by caffiend; 30-04-18 at 09:52 PM.
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    Hi caffined,

    Wow! Thanks so much for such a informative post..

    I've been told that the Concept was 20+ years old but I didn't know whether to believe it or not, being that the panel is as advanced as it is (for the 90s I mean) and that it can still be bought off the shelf! A good bit of kit... For 20+ years ago but as you say it has no place on a new site now. I agree with you, my boss still needs persuading I'm afraid.

    Sorry I should have been more clear when I was talking about a "large job", I mean domestically! I wouldn't call our jobs large in the grand scheme of things by no means.

    This should answer your 2 questions really;
    Will I need to expand to a second control panel? I seriously doubt it, expanders are all I need AFAIK.
    Will any features of the integriti software be required? Can you give me a rough outline of what these features would be? Again I doubt they would be as area arming, door control and monitoring (prefer avoiding the monthly monitoring if possible) is pretty much all we require, things that the inception can handle no problem.

    We have no software for programming the integriti so it is something that we would have to look into getting if we were to use it. I presume it is licenced software that has to be purchased? I was thinking that I needed the software alright as I was getting nowhere fast using the keypad.

    From what you are telling me it sounds like we have no real business installing the integriti and need to be using the inception, no contest!
    If I could get some points down as to why the inception beats the integriti and give the boss a full pros and cons list it might help, the boss just doesn't like the idea of the inception, and I mean the idea as he hasn't even used an inception to find fault with it!

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    Thanks for the positive feedback.
    Quote Originally Posted by fado5 View Post
    From what you are telling me it sounds like we have no real business installing the integriti and need to be using the inception, no contest!
    If I could get some points down as to why the inception beats the integriti and give the boss a full pros and cons list it might help, the boss just doesn't like the idea of the inception, and I mean the idea as he hasn't even used an inception to find fault with it!
    For the site in question, my advice would definitely be to use the Inception product. Particularly if you haven't included a Server or a copy of Integriti Pro in your quote.

    In terms of Inception's advantages.
    1. No Licensing, No Server, Simple to deploy and exposed as Web Application
    2. SkyTunnel support, simplifying access even if the device is behind a firewall or NAT with a dynamic IP
    3. Can be used from any device, be it a desktop, laptop or smartphone
    4. Has dimensions well exceeding the size of the job required
    5. Uses IR's latest hardware platform and OS behind the scenes, and will be well supported into the future with firmware upgrades and new functionality
    6. Simpler to install and maintain than Integriti as Integriti requires software to program.
    7. You cannot fully program an Integriti panel through the keypad. Please don't try
    8. Support for app based push notifications via SkyCommand
    Last edited by caffiend; 01-05-18 at 08:00 PM.
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    I think I need to show all of these points to the boss and hope he sees sense. I think the fact that the integriti needs licenced software to be programmed could sway him. I honestly can't see what his issue is with the Inception. It makes so much sense for us to use it.. crazy!
    Have you had luck with the Inception working on SkyCommand? I was told by the supplier that inception wasn't supported by SkyCommand. It's not a huge problem as I set the inception to send email notifications of alarms and put a shortcut to the inception web interface on the clients phone but having the app with push notifications and full app based control would be a bonus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fado5 View Post
    Ok so I have been with my new company with about 6 months now and the boss has been getting me to install the Concept 4K everywhere.
    The system seems clunky, over complicated and very un-user friendly.

    I finally persuaded him to get away from the Concept and to try the Inception. I installed one on a private job (that he knew about) fast, streamlined, a breeze to install/program and the post install IP login is a godsend! Everything was great.
    So I told the boss how great it was and he immediately told me he wants to use the Integriti on a large upcoming job!
    He has never used the integriti, I have never used it and we got a "training panel" on loan that seems to be doing nothing but confusing me!
    The majority of jobs we do are large 30+ zones with 2/4 access control doors and we remotely arm/disarm.

    Can anyone tell me the ups and downs of these systems? Because as far as I can see the Inception does everything that the Concept and the Integriti do but does it better. Am I missing something? Apart from the base Inception only having 8 zones vs the Concept/Integriti having 16?

    Somebody please help me out as I'm pulling my hair out here!
    Hi there,

    Integriti is Awesome!
    Concept 4000 is a rock solid product but dated now.
    Inception may be the better solution if you are not content with purchasing or supporting the headend software.
    I cannot believe a supplier has given you a "training panel" without any sample software - absolute joke, don't waste your time!
    Keypad programming is practically impossible........if it even works at all?
    All IR products are very reliable.

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    Yeah it looks like the boss won't be purchasing the software, I may be wrong but it looks that way.
    Think I will have to contact the supplier in regards to sample software and take a 2nd stab at programming. I'll at least give the integriti a fair go but if I can get away with it I will be pushing for inception installs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fado5 View Post
    Have you had luck with the Inception working on SkyCommand? I was told by the supplier that inception wasn't supported by SkyCommand. It's not a huge problem as I set the inception to send email notifications of alarms and put a shortcut to the inception web interface on the clients phone but having the app with push notifications and full app based control would be a bonus.
    Multipath support told me that that the skycommand app currently works with inception when you have a T4000 connected. They said they have plans to support Inception directly in the future.

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    Old thread I know, but I can confirm @carbon's statement,
    At present, the SkyCommand App is for the T4000 Communicator, which then communicates with an alarm panel, be it Inception, Integriti, Concept, or any number of 3rd party panels.

    The work to enable direct SkyCommand-to-Inception is underway, but ongoing so there is no release timeframe yet.

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    I have also heard from support that although inception access to the sky command app is in the works, he imagined that it will be on a pay monthly basis.
    He said he couldn't imagine it being free like skytunnel.

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