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Thread: Do you Earth your Dishes ?

  1. #21
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    I noticed that the term stepped leader has been introduced in this field , my thesis was in 1968/69 so please excuse me from the terminology in my day they were refered to as a spur ! the " plasma" that you refer to is actually ionisation of the local gasses which is a plasma stream but with out selected gasses every gas gets the treatment especially oxygen and nitrogen the oxygen turns into ozone ,ie o3 which you can smell after a lightening event .YT has some vids on it google slow motion lightening which may help the mind
    . Please treat people as you would like to be treated yourself.

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    I won't enter into this discussion....it's way above my pay grade.

    But thought these couple of links might be interesting:

    Why does lightning strike from the ground-up?



    Protection Against Dangerous Lightning Strikes and Their Secondary Effects


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  • #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by hinekadon View Post
    I wonder how much you have read up on this subject ????
    I cant read and adsorb it after the 3 rd Stroke. I Find reading very extremely difficult some times because my Brain wont adsorb it and if it very complicated I defiantly wont adsorb it but I am still very good thinking out of the square to a point that I can built a complicated Computer with twin 1080's GPU for ????????. My doctor and specialist said to me not to torment yourself, but at the same time I wont sit there staring out the window looking the TV.

    I say this to everyone I wish for one hour the Issue I have other people have it and see what I going through My Friend I will never give up, I'm extremely stubborn and will never give up even if it take 6 times the time to do something.

    All I need is some to be written in Point Formation 'EG"
    Mr 672a
    1/ Earth all you dishes via a single rod to each as close as possible with 6mm cable with NO BENDS on the Cable.

    2/ Use So and son on this and that.

    3/ also do this and that

    Yeah my Brain like it like this!!! and has massive issue in comprehensions things (thank God for spell checker)


    Cant help the way my Brain is but I can go with it or go around this issue and this is way I always have my daughter involved with anything to do beside she learns

    Anyhow Back on topic and the topic is What does one room TV gets effected when there is a Bad Storm yes all the other room TV's are OK and my Main TV room with a 75 inch Tv + 8 24 inch monitors + Plenty of Sat Boxes + at least 6 Amps and one Amp Processor (pre outs) are not effected at all in 10 years


    ps: i'm thinking out of the square, I want to see if the eat room is on the same Phase as the Main TV room or I might run a extension lead from the main tv room from spare P/P on the same point and run it to the eat Room.
    Last edited by Mr 672A; 01-09-19 at 11:33 AM.
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  • #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thala Dan View Post
    I won't enter into this discussion....it's way above my pay grade.

    But thought these couple of links might be interesting:

    Why does lightning strike from the ground-up?



    Protection Against Dangerous Lightning Strikes and Their Secondary Effects

    its not above my pay grade but it above the brain the way its Constructed after the series of Strokes
    Not responsible for any post written after the 28/10/2014. My pet hate, Corrupt Politicians, Corrupt Legal System + a legal system Australia wide that does not allow you to sue a Solicitor or Barrister for Professional Negligence (as Stated by the Law Society and prominent Lawyers) and Corrupt Cops. Not necessarily in this order. Please Note Lawyers are PROTECTED SPECIES IN THIS COUNTRY, PROTECTED FROM THEIR F..K UPS

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  • #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by westom View Post
    The first mistake is to assume a millimeters gap in an RCD will block what three kilometers of sky cannot. Or that an RCD, that takes milliseconds or longer to trip, will somehow 'block' a transient done in microseconds.

    Only urban myths 'block' or 'absorb' that energy from a surge. And yet that is exactly what a Belkin or equivalent magic boxes must do. How does its 600 joules 'absorb' a surge that can be hundreds of thousands of joules?

    Second, wall receptacle safety ground is completely different from many other, electrically different grounds (logic ground, floating ground, analog ground, ground plane on an antenna, virtual ground, ground beneath shoes that is relevant for static electricity, chassis ground, power ground, or earth ground). Only relevant ground is earth ground. It must be 'single point earth ground', as another may have noted. (All four words have electrical significance.)

    Relevant concept was demonstrated by Franklin over 250 years ago. Lightning connected to distant earthborne charges destructively via something more conductive - wooden church steeple. But that steeple is not very conductive. So steeple damaged.

    Franklin simply connected direct lightning strikes to earth via something very conductive. So lightning no longer connected to distant charges (maybe four kilometers away) destructively via a steeple.

    Lightning connect to distant earthborne charges destructively via appliances. But appliances are not sufficiently conductive. So appliances (ie satellite dish electronics) damaged.

    Solution implemented the world over, even 100 years ago, connected lightning to distant earthborne charges via a 'whole house' protector that connects low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth. So lightning no longer connected to distant charges (maybe four kilometers away) destructively via any household appliance (including dish electronics).

    Third, an AC utility demonstrates how to avert damage. View good, bad, and ugly (preferred, wrong, and right) installations at:

    then select Tech Tip 8.

    Protection is always about how that electric current connects from the cloud (maybe three kilometers up) to earthborne charges (maybe 4 kilometers through earth). Protection means that path is not anywhere inside. That means every wire inside every incoming cable must make a low impedance (ie less than 3 meter) connection to the same earth ground. Not wall receptacle safety ground or any other ground. It must be those earthing electrodes.

    If any other earth ground is used, then all protection is compromised.

    Four, these techniques are well understood. Each dish is treated as if separate structures. So each dish must have its own single point earth ground. Its coax cable must connect directly (low impedance) to that earth ground.

    At the other end of each cable must be a low impedance (ie hardwire has no sharp bends) connection to the building's earth ground. That connection made BEFORE that coax cable enters.

    Well, that best protection (that uses no protector) means a surge is not incoming on any dish. But most surges are incoming on AC mains. A direct lightning strike to AC wires many blocks down the street is a direct strike incoming to every appliance. Are all damaged? Of course not. This is electricity. So it must also have a completely different outgoing path to earth ground. Only some appliances might make a destructive outgoing connection.

    Incoming on AC mains. Outgoing destructively to earth via the sat decoder and properly earthed coax cables. Once a surge is all but invited inside by any wire, then it will go hunting for earth ground destructively via any appliances.

    Protection means every wire (all AC wires) also must connect to that same earth ground. Safety codes only define one AC wire connected to earth. Surge protection means all wires must connect to earth. So all over the world, that connection is made by a 'whole house' protector.

    Again, that connection must be low impedance. A protector must make a less than 3 meter connection from each AC wire to single point ground. That connection must have no sharp bends or splices, not be inside metallic conduit, must be separated from other non-grounding wire, and must as short as possible. Connector length is more critical than connector diameter.

    Obviously most of this was unknown by most others. And yet this technology has been standard in all Telstra facilities for longer than any of us have existed.

    Again, no plug-in box does or even claims to provide effective protection. The effective protectors come from other manufacturers who a have earned a reputation for integrity (Belkin has not). Such as Clipsal, ABB, Siemens, and Novaris to name but a few.

    Five, lightning is typically 20,000 amps. (Static electricity is microamps - irrelelvant.) So a minimal 'whole house' protector is 50,000 amps. Because protectors must remain functional for many decades after multiple direct lightning strikes. These effective products will probably cost about $1 per protected appliance - tens of times less than Belkin.

    An effective solution will always answer this question. Where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate? That hardwire connection from coax to earth ground or that low impedance connection from AC mains to earth ground - both are answers to that question. Belkin's answer: a paltry 600 joules. Ineffective protection. And another device that must be protected by the 'whole house' solution.

    Finally, best evidence is found in each damaged electronics. Damage defines incoming and outgoing paths. Damage is most often on the outgoing path. How does that cloud connect to earth and earthborne charges some 4 km distant? Damage only happens when the path is anywhere inside a building. Nothing inside a building even claims to protect from such transients. Damage is always averted when that transient current connects to earth BEFORE entering a building.
    My friend Westom can you give me in point formation what you would do. I think you are very similar as to what member MTV is saying.

    1/ westom says

    2/ westom says

    3/ westom says


    Thank you
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  • #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by fisht99 View Post
    You electrical system is not complex at all. Multiple circuits protected by RCD is very common. However I am concerned about the phase to neutral voltage of 212V.

    How accurate is your measurement? Is it the same between phase and earth?
    I have two Multi Meters one is a FLUKE and measures in I think both read RMS. Yes ENERGEX last Summer had 4 monitors put in the Extended Pillar boxes for a full week around the streets but the week was colder (typical) so they can Monitor the 3Phases and they found that the last two houses on the end of the cul-de-sac (our Pillar) which one is us have a extreme low voltage on very hot days around 212 or 214V AC per from phase to neutral. Trust Me I have a 3M temperature thingy the ones the V'8 Supercars use to measure the track temperature so I went around the street to see if one of the pillars have a hot spot in it but I found none. Anyhow this summer is Coming but this time I will be ready and waiting and this OLD MAN Wont give up until this issue is fixed by Energex. By the way Energex white Paper says the Min Voltage to you house is 206V not 216 V as most know. Yes I have a Copy of it. I suspect from the last Pillar to our pillar where the two house are and one of them is us has underground 3 Phase @ 16 MM not 32 MMMM for the two house and one of them have a LARGE AIR CON. Will find out soon (the main street has 120MM the Cul de sacs with limited houses has 32 mm but our one because we have two Houses with Larger Blocks only has one pillar shared by the two of us and it should be 32mm not 16 mm. Will find out soon nought but this is another issue and possible, yes possible not to do with a stormy day and one tv room that is effected

    After the RCD is a lot more complicated but a mile. No one has on the lounge room wall a Solar Hot water Monitoring System designed by me and 2 inched away have a panel that tells me how much water is in the water tanks that feed the Toilets to save water, Yes this was though out and done by me after the third stroke , It make me happy to see my brain is still thinking, I''' see If I can stick pic on the Forum.
    Last edited by Mr 672A; 01-09-19 at 12:08 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thala Dan View Post
    Protection Against Dangerous Lightning Strikes and Their Secondary Effects
    That microwave journal article is promoting ESE devices - a well understood scam. For example, the ESE industry tried to get their device listed in the National Electrical Code. It was roundly rejected. ESE manufacturers then tried to bankrupt the non-profit NFPA (publishers of the NEC) by suing. The Bryan Panel Report resulted:
    The ESE lightning protection technology as currently developed in the installation of complete systems does not appear to be scientifically and technically sound in relation to the claimed areas of protection or the essentials of the grounding system.
    Clearly noted was that ESE manufacturers spend massively promoting devices that will magically discharge the air. And not one science based study could be found that proves / justifies the myth. The report said the industry should do at least one research study to justify their product. None exist.

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  • #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by westom View Post
    That microwave journal article is promoting ESE devices - a well understood scam. For example, the ESE industry tried to get their device listed in the National Electrical Code. It was roundly rejected. ESE manufacturers then tried to bankrupt the non-profit NFPA (publishers of the NEC) by suing. The Bryan Panel Report resulted:

    Clearly noted was that ESE manufacturers spend massively promoting devices that will magically discharge the air. And not one science based study could be found that proves / justifies the myth. The report said the industry should do at least one research study to justify their product. None exist.
    I understand the above, it seems like some in the Medical profession. This tablet Cures or fixes stroke patients with their memory but yet they scientifically can prove it in any way and the only thing they can prove is the $$$$$$$ you pay for it..
    Not responsible for any post written after the 28/10/2014. My pet hate, Corrupt Politicians, Corrupt Legal System + a legal system Australia wide that does not allow you to sue a Solicitor or Barrister for Professional Negligence (as Stated by the Law Society and prominent Lawyers) and Corrupt Cops. Not necessarily in this order. Please Note Lawyers are PROTECTED SPECIES IN THIS COUNTRY, PROTECTED FROM THEIR F..K UPS

  • #29
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    Just as a note. Last Summer when out NEW (under warranty) Eat room TV shi.t itself (HDMI Board) there repair man told me he had replace at least 10 boards either HDMI or the complete board and in each case all customers has Foxtel Now Foxtel have their dish on the Room now I dont have Foxtel but have plenty of Dishes but all of them are on the ground and because of this you can see how vicious lightning is and considering I have dishes from 2.3M to 80 CM I have plenty of area to attract static-induced discharge .
    Last edited by Mr 672A; 03-09-19 at 09:30 AM.
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  • #30
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    Well Energex just finished replacing out Underground Mains that were 90 M long and the original ones were 16MM 3 phase. also they noted on my Pillar we had no earth electrode so now we have 70MM underground mains not 16MM plus we have a New earth electrode as they said the earth was a border line of not being good at our pillar. I also spoke about earthing my 9 dishes and he recommend to earth them with 16 MM cable and show me the lug that you can buy for a 16mm cable for standard 2.4MM earth rod
    Not responsible for any post written after the 28/10/2014. My pet hate, Corrupt Politicians, Corrupt Legal System + a legal system Australia wide that does not allow you to sue a Solicitor or Barrister for Professional Negligence (as Stated by the Law Society and prominent Lawyers) and Corrupt Cops. Not necessarily in this order. Please Note Lawyers are PROTECTED SPECIES IN THIS COUNTRY, PROTECTED FROM THEIR F..K UPS

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