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Thread: Coronavirus

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    Quote Originally Posted by tristen View Post
    I find it very sad indeed to see such sentiments expressed here, by members who I otherwise respected.

    So little value for human life...

    So cynical...

    So little respect for those who govern and are faced with difficult and often life-changing decisions.

    Shame on you and others of similar outlook.

    The premiers and I think alike in these matters and for that I am extremely thankful.

    They care....

    My family and close friends care....

    I care....


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  • #1922
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    Quote Originally Posted by tristen View Post
    I find it very sad indeed to see such sentiments expressed here, by members who I otherwise respected.

    So little value for human life...

    So cynical...

    So little respect for those who govern and are faced with difficult and often life-changing decisions.

    Shame on you and others of similar outlook.

    The premiers and I think alike in these matters and for that I am extremely thankful.

    They care....

    My family and close friends care....

    I care....
    So little value for human life...

    These people are entrusted to make decisions based on scientific and recommended evidence. They embarked on a course of action via federal and state co-operation brilliantly arrived at by Brendan Murphy and his national health team, and supported by the PM. As a result, this nation escaped what could have been a nasty and deadly death toll. Since that effort, they have almost all cynically scared the population and departed from what was a successful and working plan and switched to a greedy self centred "elect me 'cause I saved you" lock down and elimination strategy determined by public servants. One has failed spectacularly, and that's beyond sad.

    The death toll in suicides, the lost business, the financial ruin, babies dying because hard border closures are inflexible. These decisions have been taken in opposition to all scientific evidence. All over politics. Nothing more. And you say I am cynical....jeez thats rich....

    So little respect for those who govern and are faced with difficult and often life-changing decisions.

    I have all the respect in the world for those that govern. I have NO respect for those that rule. There's very little "governance" here, just cynical manipulation. You can fall for the boogieman fearmongering all you like, that's your right.

    They care....

    My family and close friends care....

    I care....[


    The premiers, for the most part, couldn't give a sh!t beyond covering up their own mistakes and saving their jobs. The old political saying "never waste a good crisis" was never so well proven true. Corona virus (and diseases like it) will never be entirely eliminated, so showing a little courage and living with minimisation as was the original strategy would have saved countless thousands of destroyed livelihoods, saved actual lives, and probably prevented national financial ruin.

    I care. It's hard to see my country go down this ruinous path so cavalierly orchestrated by greedy, self centred politicians and their self interested minions....and to have it supported by the stupidity and fear of large sections of the population.

    Whilst I respect your opinion on this, I completely and totally disagree.
    The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.

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  • #1923
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    Quote Originally Posted by tristen View Post
    I find it very sad indeed to see such sentiments expressed here, by members who I otherwise respected.

    So little value for human life...

    So cynical...

    So little respect for those who govern and are faced with difficult and often life-changing decisions.

    Shame on you and others of similar outlook.

    The premiers and I think alike in these matters and for that I am extremely thankful.

    They care....

    My family and close friends care....

    I care....
    tristen, I am not sure people read correctly what others say about premiers actions. No one here takes someone else's death lightly, it is a tragedy and we are all devastated about loses.

    No one is saying we shouldn't have any measures to prevent deaths. When we had the so-called first wave people went into lockdown. People were not happy but accepted the need.

    The facts tell us that what premiers say and what they actually do are two different things. Hence we had this so-called "second wave" in Victoria.
    And mishandling of the out brakes continuous.
    Premier of Victoria with his cabinet absolutely useless bunch of liars. Instead of working on isolating out brakes they simply shutdown everything around. It is much easier to do, isn't it?

    Now, what do people who are grateful and support premiers actions do in fact? Don't you think they create an environment promoting premiers to continue their criminal strategy? A lot of people and I certainly think that way. Some support premiers because they don't think it through all the way or simply being misled or if you wish brainwashed. Others do it to chase their own political agenda.

    In 1960 KGB conducted an experiment feeding misinformation to a large group of people for two months. The result was that large percentage of the group absolutely believed in the misinformation to the extend they couldn't accept proof and facts showing the information was wrong. They couldn't be persuaded otherwise for a long time. Can anyone see any similarity with what we see today?

    A little bit out of topic. I am not sure why did media use second, third etc wave terminology? According to epidemiology infection waves refer to the same people re-infection. What we see is the mishandled first wave in Victoria. My jaw always drop when I hear our premier and CHO talk about how tricky the virus is coming back to create the second wave. This is complete rubbish designed to mask their incompetence and it is sad to see some people can't see it this way promoting the criminal practice by showing their support. tristen, I certainly don't put you into the category of people who are responsible for any of this and I hope that you and other people wake up to the reality one day.

    It's all like leaving through Matrix.
    Last edited by fromaron; 23-10-20 at 08:29 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tristen View Post
    I find it very sad indeed to see such sentiments expressed here, by members who I otherwise respected.

    So little value for human life...

    So cynical...

    So little respect for those who govern and are faced with difficult and often life-changing decisions.

    Shame on you and others of similar outlook.

    The premiers and I think alike in these matters and for that I am extremely thankful.

    They care....

    My family and close friends care....

    I care....

    It's clear you have not been affected not only by the China Flu but also missed out on the incompetence and mishandling of this charade. Lucky you!

    You clearly haven't watched a Business you worked hard for for years go down the shitter. You haven't lost your home or suffered the financial ruin that you will never recover from.
    You have not been locked up in a state you don't live in while Your sick Wife at home is trying to raise your baby and your mother is Dying of cancer and you can't see her like my friends.
    You have not had your life plans thrown into turmoil and your future rendered unknown. You Will probably be paying for this for the rest of your days and so will your kids whether you have the smarts to realise it or not.
    The list goes on and it's all based on a LIE now.


    The initial idea of " Flatten the curve made sense. Now that's well and truly past, the practice of locking down MILLIONS of people because 3 people were discovered with it and 2 Elderly people most likley with pre existing conditions that made their end a matter of anytime now anyway pass away is a whole different thing.
    When people are getting fined for putting their Bins out at midnight without wearing a mask 12 Feet from their front door and Police are arresting people for calling for a peaceful protest to the lockdowns on facewaste as well as exhibiting unlimited other examples of Gestapo like behaviour, any normal thinking person can see the so called leaders in charge are NOT doing a good job at all and in fact doing a piss poor one.

    One of these premiers in particular has been caught out in multiple lies. There are clips of them saying one thing then the complete opposite. It's indisputable then there was the lies or untruths given to enquiry's into the fiascos they caused to get out of taking responsibility for their incompetence and lies. How anyone can think they have done anything worth while is beyond me. I do have a few " Business " opportunities that will make you rich I'd like to show you though.

    On one hand these premiers were citing medical evidence. Now the very sources of the medical evidence they were citing and pinning their actions on has completely changed and they are citing " Chief health orificers" Some whom have NO medical qualifications at all and are going against the advice of pretty much every medical association or authority. They are not taking responsibility, they are not making decisions based on fact , logic or even sound advise. They are making shit up as they go along and clearly getting it wrong and then trying to cover it up with more incompetence.

    That's not looking after people, that's Tyranny.

    Saying they care I'm sorry is Laughable. Oh, they care alright, they care about THEIR jobs, their incomes and covering their own arses to hide the indisputable stuff ups they won't take responsibility for and doing everything to deflect looking like the traitors they are. They care about your vote and in this case the people Gullible and unintelligent enough to be deceived into thinking they are doing anything right.

    I don't think many people would argue that the measures being taken now and for some months back, are doing more damage now in so many ways than what the thing they are trying to... eliminate as it is now is doing by a long shot. Going back to medical FACT that was determined long before this China Pox came along, It's impossible to eradicate a Virus like this which is just another flu but that's exactly what these power tripping premiers are trying to sell you on is for your own good.
    It's ridiculous and completely against the interests of the people, the country and the well being and future of both.


    You may fall for it but don't get on your moral High horse and try and shame me for not falling for and swallowing the same idiotic traitorous bullshit you have.

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    One thing that has been on my feeble mind with all this concerning the lives lost with this China pox and the effect it has seperately on millions that probably have not had it....

    Deaths were always going to happen the same as they do every year with every Flu. That was unavoidable. I fully believe now the amount of deaths from suicides would far outstrip those from the Virus and probably have for some time back. I'd also gaurantee those deaths are from people with a lot more useful, productive years left in them with much brighter and long term futures than those the Pox has sadly taken because they were aged with low Immunity or pre existing conditions that made them more susceptible to any sickness.

    I think that's a parameter that should be looked at. I do not believe the simple statistic of " Deaths" tells near the full story. Something like "years of life expectancy lost" would be a whole lot more accurate. Someone in their '70's or 80s has NO life expectancy. They can drop at any time and no one is surprised or would say anything other than "they had a good innings. " Same with people that have other conditions that lower their immunity and they are taking medication for. My own Diabetes leaves me susceptible to a whole range of things I have to be careful of but for the most part, I am not what I'd call sick as such. By the same token, it's clear I'm not expected to live to the age my father is Now by a long shot and there is just as much chance of me falling off the perch as him.

    When a 40 or 50Yo dies, people say they died young. When the 70-80 yo dies of a flu, that's life. When a 40 Yo takes their own life in depression, that's a Fking tragedy and No one sees any upside or has any comfort in that.
    .
    And it's exactly whats happening now and it's happening because of not only this Virus but the mishandling of it in states of this country. I know damn well if I lost everything I have and the shit I have been through to get it, I wouldn't be sticking around I don't know how I have managed to so far anyway but there is a limit to what one can take. I can well see how many people with their hopes and dreams torn away from them and no way to even have a clue how to plan a way forward would be broken and want to end their pain and suffering they see no way out of.

    Again, i'd guarantee, more years of life and lives with a positive future ahead of them are being lost than the completely questionable years of those that were at the end of the road and maybe living on borrowed time.

    300- 70-80 Yo's who dies of the pox -Might- have 500 years of life expectancy. And I think that's being generous. 100 40 yo's probably have 3000 years of life expectancy. Lower the ages a bit as I'm certain also comes into it, and you may also be looking at adding in Kids they never had the chance to have and then you are looking at 5000 years without a doubt.

    No one would dismiss the importance of quality of life and in this case I think it applies equally and is something that certainly should be taken into account.

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    Always hard to comment on something still in process ; lets see how the northern hemisphere survive their winter.

    One has to decide, the size of the threat ; there'd be probably two leading groups - those that think this flu strain should be eradicated, and those that think we should get on with life 'as per normal', and humanity as a whole just along with the fact these types of virus exist, and how for a treatment or vaccine to be developed. If you think about what's going on, how different is it from




    Bring that up to the now;



    Give it I don't know how many years after I'm dead, someone will do a search on the string 'is the covid19 flu still around?' They'll get the same answer
    Last edited by wotnot; 23-10-20 at 07:23 PM.

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    I think the young people of today are going to be telling their Grand kids about 2020 and the grand kids are going to be wondering If they have been on the sauce down at the Bowls club or it's time to start making arrangements for them to move into a facility where they can get looked after because they may not be up to looking after themselves much longer.

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    Default A sensible government response to COVID 19 from the Johns Hopkins Research Centre

    A Fireside Chat with Dr. Anthony Fauci

    Go to

    Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, joins Ellen MacKenzie, dean of the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health, to discuss the COVID-19 pandemic and reflect on his nearly 40-year career as a leader in public health policy.

    ----------------------------

    nature

    Nature is a British weekly scientific journal founded and based in London, England, since November 1869–present.
    As a multidisciplinary publication, Nature features peer-reviewed research from a variety of academic disciplines, mainly in science, technology, and the natural sciences.


    NEWS FEATURE 21 October 2020

    The false promise of herd immunity for COVID-19

    Go to

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    Quote Originally Posted by george65 View Post
    I think the young people of today are going to be telling their Grand kids about 2020
    Saw this brilliant poster the other day:
    Mum is fitting a mask to her teen daughter who asks - "Mum, what is immunity?". Mum's answer is - "Don't pay attention to this rubbish, immunity is just another conspiracy theory."

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    The downside of being in politics of any persuasion is that you are not going to make the right decision for a portion of the population. Regardless of you leanings a pollie, Premiers and the like, can only make decisions based on the information that they are given and only based upon the "good" of all. We may not necessarily agree with them, but they, all of them, I believe, are trying to do the best for their state/country.

    That said, sometimes they do get side tracked and, hopefully, get called to task on it. I do, seriously believe that many who enter parliament are seriously trying to improve our country. Whether they get side tracked along the way is another argument entirely.
    I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message...

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    Quote Originally Posted by lsemmens View Post
    ..............................................

    That said, sometimes they do get side tracked and, hopefully, get called to task on it. I do, seriously believe that many who enter parliament are seriously trying to improve our country. Whether they get side tracked along the way is another argument entirely.
    Sidetracked? If they don't do what the party machine wants, they're out. Simple. All ALP politicians are bound by caucus, not conscience. And whilst no such formal rule applies to the liberals, they are under the same pressure.

    Thus they almost all sell out. I have nothing but contempt for most of them....
    The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.

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    I agree with lsemmens.

    My father warned me never to go into politics, because you'll always end up wrong.

    ENF, I thought that you were better than this.

    You're beginning to sound like George

    Give it a rest.

    Take up fishing....Join a golf club or something.... Broaden your mind.

    Employ your time more profitably elsewhere, or are you going to be a sad old woman of the male variety and whinge forever?
    Last edited by tristen; 24-10-20 at 09:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by enf View Post
    Sidetracked? If they don't do what the party machine wants, they're out. Simple. All ALP politicians are bound by caucus, not conscience. And whilst no such formal rule applies to the liberals, they are under the same pressure.

    Thus they almost all sell out. I have nothing but contempt for most of them....
    I think Peter Garret was a classic example of this. I believe he went into it trying to make a difference and do some good. I also believe he was corrupted by the cesspit of politics and forced to play the game and become another cog in the mechanical wheel. He was seen as fking up but I think his intentions were good and I also know someone whom knew him well and believe he got out because he had realised what he had become and that staying in the cesspit was doing him nor the objectives he had in mind any good.

    I don't believe others like Andrews had anywhere near the good intentions when they got into politics.
    More like the dorky unpopular pain in the arse kid at school trying to get some attention and go on a power trip.
    Still a dork, unpopular and huge pain in the arse on a power trip and a pathetic coward still trying to point the finger at everyone else for his own failings.

    Many others are just in it for the money. Probably not so much the money from the job but from Kickbacks and benefits especially when they get out of the job and go back into the private sector with cushy well overpaid jobs from those they helped when they were in politics.
    Last edited by george65; 25-10-20 at 12:42 AM.

  • #1934
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    Quote Originally Posted by tristen View Post
    I agree with lsemmens.

    My father warned me never to go into politics, because you'll always end up wrong.

    ENF, I thought that you were better than this.

    You're beginning to sound like George

    Give it a rest.

    Take up fishing....Join a golf club or something.... Broaden your mind.

    Employ your time more profitably elsewhere, or are you going to be a sad old woman of the male variety and whinge forever?
    You made what I considered to be a ridiculous assertion as to the motivations of our politicians...I merely responded to the contrary with an example or two. If you REALLY believe what you say then I feel a little sad for you.....seriously.

    As to the "sad old woman" assertion, well, in reality I'm an upbeat type.... Watching this country dissolve is hard though. I feel that our generation has failed the future in that regard. I just refuse to be silenced by the gullible.
    The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.

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    It's pretty hard to support Dan now. Everytime a public holiday, school holiday, anytime there is a chance of a gathering etc, restrictions get drawn out as he keeps extending the restrictions to get past all these occasions. This also happened in the first wave. And of course was the case the other week and it was to get past the grand final long weekend and now even though we are now below the magic number 5 infections, currently at 4.6, he will again extend the restrictions so we get past the Melbourne Cup long weekend preventing more gatherings etc. and not keeping his promise and following his roadmap out of his cluster fk that he created. He always finds an excuse and yes there is a cluster in the northern suburbs of Melb but we have to learn to live and deal with them as the arise. This will continue to happen. You can't keep people locked up forever. FFS, Sydney should have been closed down recently but no they had it all under control. Comes down to the way you manage things.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeroyPatrol View Post
    It's pretty hard to support Dan now. Everytime a public holiday, school holiday, anytime there is a chance of a gathering etc, restrictions get drawn out as he keeps extending the restrictions to get past all these occasions. This also happened in the first wave. And of course was the case the other week and it was to get past the grand final long weekend and now even though we are now below the magic number 5 infections, currently at 4.6, he will again extend the restrictions so we get past the Melbourne Cup long weekend preventing more gatherings etc. and not keeping his promise and following his roadmap out of his cluster fk that he created. He always finds an excuse and yes there is a cluster in the northern suburbs of Melb but we have to learn to live and deal with them as the arise. This will continue to happen. You can't keep people locked up forever. FFS, Sydney should have been closed down recently but no they had it all under control. Comes down to the way you manage things.
    As far as I was aware, the NSW tracing system was supposed to be adopted as the national standard. It appears to work.
    The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by enf View Post
    As far as I was aware, the NSW tracing system was supposed to be adopted as the national standard. It appears to work.
    It's going to work to keep me from eating out anywhere that's for sure!
    Sick and Fking tired of having to go through all the bullshit and risk of having ones identity stolen everytime you go somewhere for a feed.
    The other night had to show licence which they scanned and took a picture of me to go with it. Yesterday this Gestapo bitch on the door of the pub making us stand there fking around scanning these barcode thing that the stupid cow admitted weren't working. No book to just leave your details, have to do it on your phone. I said flat out to Mrs and daughter, they can shove their food up their arse, I'm not standing here begging them in to let me support their business. If I can't put my details down in a book like other places they can get stuffed.
    Then gestapo bitch in her power tripping " Covid Marshall " Vest came marching up and took my temperature. I just shook my head and said FFS!

    She might have a Job to do but she could have done it like a person not an arrogant bitch. She was no asset to the business that's for sure.
    When we were leaving it was raining and daughter went to get the car. Covid Gestapo came up and started Crapping on about the 8 or so people standing there also waiting, to Maintain Social Distancing. I looked and said you must be fking joking! You are standing closer to people than anyone else here, get the hell back inside. Couple of other people laughed and she went back in with tail between her legs. I'm over it, completely over it.

    I said to wife and daughter, I'm not going out anywhere again till this bullshit is over and if it doesen't change, looks like this is the last time I'll be eating out.
    I can't stand the stupidity and insult to ones intelligence with this. Did they check everyone for the flu last year? Did they check everyone for SARS when that was going round.

    6.4M people in the state and how may case's have there been in the last week? 5, 10?

    I realise I'm bitching about what others in Vic would think was a godsend and that's the problem.
    Our freedoms are being taken away and then handed back in crumbs and we are supposed to be happy and Thankful about that. It's a stunt that's been used before in some of History's most infamous times of oppression and dictatorships. All the lessons from the past are being forgotten and we are going down the self same road. All the technology and advancement in the world and we are being reduced to brainless sheep no more educated or aware than people 300 years ago.

    I can see it coming that before long if this shit keeps up we will all have an " Identity" or "Tracing card" sold to us by the gummermints as a wonderful thing to keep us safe and make going out simpler and more convenient. "Just put your card in the scanner everywhere you go like restaurants, the supermarket, servo, bank and doctor and walk right in. Alternatively, to make it even easier, you can have your bar code tattooed on the back of your hand or forehead so you have it wherever you go...."

    The really worrying bit is morons like my brother in law whom is still apparently posting about the Covid app on farce book and imploring anyone who still hasn't downloaded to to do it, would think this was a great thing and deny it had anything to do with big brother, control or Ulterior Motives.
    Expected to attend the Nephews 21st in a couple of weeks. I fully expect BIL to be standing at the door taking temperatures and find crosses on the floor and " Don't sit here " Stickers on the chairs and lounges.

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  • #1938
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    Quote Originally Posted by enf View Post
    You made what I considered to be a ridiculous assertion as to the motivations of our politicians...I merely responded to the contrary with an example or two.
    What ridiculous assertion?

    If you REALLY believe what you say then I feel a little sad for you.....seriously.
    Ah.... ENF. That you should feel a little sad for me. How touching. Thank You! Really. (Where have the smileys gone?).

    As to the "sad old woman" assertion, well, in reality I'm an upbeat type.... Watching this country dissolve is hard though. I feel that our generation has failed the future in that regard. I just refuse to be silenced by the gullible.
    I take "upbeat" to mean happy, enthusiastic.

    Yes, this country is not what it used to be, but that results from people not being what they used to be.

    Values change with the passing of each generation.

    Our generation? I was born in 1942, during the war. No, my parents did not have to "get married". Believe it or not, they married for love (so they told me) and I came along a year or so later.

    I don't think that my generation particularly failed the future. If you think so, please say in what way have we failed?

    Getting back to coronavirus (in particular, COVID19), I believe that it is here to stay until a vaccine is developed to combat it. I have been saying this for months now.

    In the meantime, each and every one of us needs to be wary - to avoid situations where we are likely to come into contact with it (and thus, also reduce the risk of passing it on to others.

    Personally, I always avoid people who shows signs of such maladies as coughs, colds and other obvious symptoms. I always have and always will. Personal hygiene and cleanliness comes naturally to me as my father, who was a paramedic in the army, always insisted on it, as did my mother.

    To me, it's just good, old common sense, although many people, including today's generation of young people seem to exhibit a profound lack of it. (In this, their parents have failed them).

    As one of my lecturers said some years ago, "common sense? It's highly debatable if such a thing exists"

    I tend to agree with her.

    Stay safe.

  • #1939
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    Zero is a beautiful number for Victoria and still Dan Andrews will NOT open up.. The average is now 3.6 well below what he promised.

    This is hurting all Victorians.. What is he waiting for ? Open up and let us breath FFS.

  • #1940
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    so is a 3.6 infection rate less than 5 yet?

    .....Leroy (rolling eyes)

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