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Thread: ESports Racing

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    Default ESports Racing

    Noted the F1 & MotoGp have some ERaces on with some of the real racers participating.
    Happy to discuss all Esports here.

    But of late the V8 Supercars have gone full race mode with as many they can get of the current racers. Last weeks was great & the graphics were so good that it was almost real (a few beers needed for this experience lol).

    It's on every Wednesday on Fox sports at 7PM & this week we have Max Verstappen doing a wild card, should be extremely entertaining.




    Have a look, discuss & enjoy.
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    This is Video games?

    Are they Fking serious? Do the drivers drive the cars somehow or it it all just animated by computer?

    I would ask who the fk would be interested in that but then I remember how many people are brainwashed by video games these days ... much as it does my head in why anyone over the age of 15 would be bothered.

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    geo those things are like a airplane flight simulator with the track all built in so ???? thats why
    are you a self appointed hypocrite sheriff or just a nasty person

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    Quote Originally Posted by hinekadon View Post
    geo those things are like a airplane flight simulator with the track all built in so ???? thats why
    So a video Game?
    How many of the regular fans are watching and accepting this?

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    There is a track day group that always ran track days 5 or so times a year at Winton raceway turn to using this when the covid isolation and social distancing kicked in.

    Was a great success with the group of track day junkies, they enjoyed it.

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    Well george, I find it quite entertaining.
    If you haven't watched it then you won't know if it is good or not.
    If you don't like this thread discussion, it's easy, don't open it.
    There is a big difference between a Video game & a Race simulation (virtual racing aka iRacing). Some drivers use Race simulation to learn new tracks before they physically go there.

    Most of the feedback from fans has been very positive.

    BTW, In the absence of real racing in this current self isolation & social distancing C19 times, I started this thread so as not to pollute the real racing threads with Esport (virtual racing) chat.


    The 4 Esport V8 Supercar races last night were very entertaining & next week they do Bathurst which should be equally entertaining.

    The Esport F1 races I've watched were also excellent. I'm looking forward to the next one.

    The Esport MotoGp races, while entertaining, are only really at game level at the moment, they need to improve the program & equipment to be up to simulation level like the V8s & F1. They also need to go full screen with the race coverage.

    here is a pic of one of the pro simulators. Bit more than a gaming rig.


    From

    A video demo of how these type of movement simulators work.

    Last edited by Tiny; 16-04-20 at 12:13 PM.
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    They are "driving" simulators so, as close to the real thing as you can get! The beauty is that if you crash and burn you can be up and racing again in a few minutes. It could be entertaining if they allow Joe Blow to join in on their xBox.
    I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message...

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    Quote Originally Posted by lsemmens View Post
    They are "driving" simulators so, as close to the real thing as you can get! The beauty is that if you crash and burn you can be up and racing again in a few minutes. It could be entertaining if they allow Joe Blow to join in on their xBox.
    They have
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    Quote Originally Posted by george65 View Post
    This is Video games?

    Are they Fking serious? Do the drivers drive the cars somehow or it it all just animated by computer?

    I would ask who the fk would be interested in that but then I remember how many people are brainwashed by video games these days ... much as it does my head in why anyone over the age of 15 would be bothered.
    Go ask a F1, Porsche Cup or V8 Supercar driver how they practice for the Melb GP, Monarco GP, or any street circuit....

    They all use Sims, as you can't practice on a track that not there 51 weeks of the year.
    If u want to go on an expedition get a Land Rover, if u want to come home from an expedition get a Landcruiser!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny View Post

    The Esport MotoGp races, while entertaining, are only really at game level at the moment, they need to improve the program & equipment to be up to simulation level like the V8s & F1. They also need to go full screen with the race coverage.

    here is a pic of one of the pro simulators. Bit more than a gaming rig.


    From

    A video demo of how these type of movement simulators work.


    I worked for somebody who had something like that home, set up for F1.
    That was over six years ago but pretty professionally built and very impressive for the time.
    Actually looked better than on that picture more like the real thing and huge screens, shame I took no photos.
    Of course he let me use it. I felt quite shaky after I did my first few laps in Albert Park. His computer business went broke and unfortunately I lost contact.
    Last edited by Uncle Fester; 17-04-20 at 12:03 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny View Post
    There is a big difference between a Video game & a Race simulation (virtual racing aka iRacing). Some drivers use Race simulation to learn new tracks before they physically go there.
    Well then the question would be why continue with real racing at all then?
    Obviously this would be infinitely cheaper, safer and much easier to put on. I'm sure they would avert a lot of problems like noise, enviro concerns and everything else and they wouldn't have to worry about poor weather and crows attendance or anything else.

    Could save them fortunes and endless logistics headaches.
    Seems like the way of the future.

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    The V8's Racing come to this channel every Wednesday at 7.00 PM. Watch both Wednesday's. Before the Race starts you have like normal on any race Mark Skaife and that Woman (forgot her name)commenting before the race and when it stats they are still commenting.. It looks very good. All the eseries have these devices in there house because you can see difference on the background shots. Wonder if the Shell Team is Cheating? (Faster computer, or faster Internet). I'll give it 95%, you have to see it so when it comes 7PM on Wednesday just click the Link. I had streamed it on a 75 inch Sony but the Res is poor.
    Last edited by Mr 672A; 17-04-20 at 09:45 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by george65 View Post
    Well then the question would be why continue with real racing at all then?
    Obviously this would be infinitely cheaper, safer and much easier to put on. I'm sure they would avert a lot of problems like noise, enviro concerns and everything else and they wouldn't have to worry about poor weather and crows attendance or anything else.

    Could save them fortunes and endless logistics headaches.
    Seems like the way of the future.
    It surprised me, watched all races, All they need now is a Higher Resolution on the above link so you can stream it to your telle if you can do it. Its poor quality on a 75 in TV,acceptable on a 50 inch tv
    Last edited by Mr 672A; 17-04-20 at 09:51 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny View Post
    Well george, I find it quite entertaining.
    If you haven't watched it then you won't know if it is good or not.
    If you don't like this thread discussion, it's easy, don't open it.
    There is a big difference between a Video game & a Race simulation (virtual racing aka iRacing). Some drivers use Race simulation to learn new tracks before they physically go there.

    Most of the feedback from fans has been very positive.

    BTW, In the absence of real racing in this current self isolation & social distancing C19 times, I started this thread so as not to pollute the real racing threads with Esport (virtual racing) chat.


    The 4 Esport V8 Supercar races last night were very entertaining & next week they do Bathurst which should be equally entertaining.

    The Esport F1 races I've watched were also excellent. I'm looking forward to the next one.

    The Esport MotoGp races, while entertaining, are only really at game level at the moment, they need to improve the program & equipment to be up to simulation level like the V8s & F1. They also need to go full screen with the race coverage.

    here is a pic of one of the pro simulators. Bit more than a gaming rig.


    From

    A video demo of how these type of movement simulators work.

    Each Driver has one of them in their house or the Factory workshop. Farrrk I wonder how much they cost?
    Not responsible for any post written after the 28/10/2014. My pet hate, Corrupt Politicians, Corrupt Legal System + a legal system Australia wide that does not allow you to sue a Solicitor or Barrister for Professional Negligence (as Stated by the Law Society and prominent Lawyers) and Corrupt Cops. Not necessarily in this order. Please Note Lawyers are PROTECTED SPECIES IN THIS COUNTRY, PROTECTED FROM THEIR F..K UPS

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr 672A View Post
    Each Driver has one of them in their house or the Factory workshop. Farrrk I wonder how much they cost?
    depends on the depth of your wallet.
    .
    Last edited by Tiny; 17-04-20 at 10:34 AM.
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    Damn, I like this.. Can I sample a free drive before choosing? lol My life needs more of this. I want one. Thanks for the links Tiny

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    I can tell you from experience that its always best to learn a track before racing on it.

    The first actual race drive i did at Winton my family laughed at me for sitting hours on end for weeks preparing by watching various in car footage of other racers driving the track.

    Studying the gear selection, different entry points, lines, exit strategies etc, replaying the run in my head.

    I went on and on my second session set the fastest time of the day, first session was to find what worked for me with minor adjustments.

    This was from many years ago playing with rally cars, some people use to count sheep to go to sleep, i use to close my eyes and see the run, every change in surface, feeling what the cars doing, you need to know the run like its second nature to maximize when you are actually racing it.

    Now days i always walk the track, things change, cracks, holes, bumps and so on.

    Now that winton has been redone, and we have reprepared the setup on one of our cars, its going to be start all over again from the beginning.

    This sort of data, simulated or other is VERY important to a driver to maximize the run.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnno View Post
    Damn, I like this.. Can I sample a free drive before choosing? lol My life needs more of this. I want one. Thanks for the links Tiny
    You could test thes out at a couple of places depending on where you live. QLD Or NZ at the moment.
    Scroll to the bottom of this link for Sim centres



    The ready to race kits with everything supplied are pretty expensive.



    Well you can probably build your own, however you need a pretty beefy PC.

    Minimum System Requirements
    ***These are our minimum requirements, just meeting these will produce graphics at our minimum in test mode***


    PC Computers:


    Windows 8.1 64-Bit, Windows 10 64-Bit
    64-bit Windows
    4 core CPU or better – Some examples (but not limited to): AMD FX-6300, Intel Core i5-4430, Intel Core i5-2320, AMD Ryzen 3 1200
    8 GB of RAM
    A gaming graphics card with at least 2GB of DEDICATED memory – Some examples (but not limited to): Nvidia GeForce GTX 660 @ 2 GB / GTX 1050 or ATI Radeon HD 7850 @ 2GB / AMD RX 550 or better
    10 GB of free disk space (40 GB for all cars and tracks)
    Microphone optional, required for voice chat



    **Note that in order to get the full dirt visual experience on iRacing you will need a computer that is capable of running graphics shaders at medium to high settings. Please contact our support team at support@iracing.com if you have questions about your PC.


    MAC Computers:


    iRacing can be run with Apple’s Boot Camp utility. For more information on installing Windows on an Apple Computer, please see your MAC user guide or this site.
    .
    Controller


    Steering wheel, analog gamepad, joystick, mouse, or any version of Windows supporting touch screen driving.
    Internet Browser Requirements


    Google Chrome, Firefox
    Javascript enabled
    Cookies enabled
    Flash Player
    Internet Connection Speed


    DSL, Cable, Fiber, 256K or faster – supported. Medium & High Earth Orbit Satellite is not supported.
    Last edited by Tiny; 17-04-20 at 02:43 PM.
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    They're actually a waste of time...those seats that is... when it comes to sim racing. Or at least, that is to say having one of those setups is entirely optional -- in a good sim, the replacement for seat of the pants, track bumps & lumps, braking/steering feel and all else a sim deprives you of, is related by visual data, and your own personal experience with that car, on that track, with those tyres, on any particular day.

    Not all sims are equal ; not everyone is in a position to know to what extent that is so... and here, I'm not talking about getting on your computer/console, and comparing 2 different racing sim programs. There's lots of pieces to fit together.

    Think like this ...who's driven a Porsche 911 series car? If you haven't, you don't know how close the car modeling is to the real thing. In fact, getting that car model right is a bit of a challenge for a sim programmer, because they have a very unique set of handling qualities. How do I know?...my uncle gave me a number of laps around Oran Park in his 400+bhp 930 Turbo back in the 80's. You can drive front engine/rwd cars all your life, and nothing has prepared you for what those whaletails are like ; if you're into driving cars, do yourself a favour and put driving one of these on your bucket list - you will never regret nor can you replace that experience.

    So I can load up any sim that includes that car & track models, already knowing what the seat of the pants and all else actually feels like, and rate the sim for accuracy. I don't need to feel the bumps, have the seat life/move about....I already know where all the bumps are on Oran Park, I already know how the car reacts to those, and *nothing* in a sim is going to replace the lateral Gforces I need to judge how close to the edge of the tyre's ability I am. Last time I checked, only rFactor/rFactor2 & iRacing has this on offer..Oran Park in a 911... for mine, rFactor wins every so slightly over iRacing, because the track model was more authentically reproduced, relative to the time I used the circuit ~ if iRacing is using a model based on the time after resurfacing the circuit, I would need to jump in that 930T again and run another 20 or so laps, to get that experience.... and if I did, I might say iRacing is better, relative to the current track condition.

    This is why rFactor has been one of my goto sims for so long ~ aussie track content, and some of those track models are extremely accurate. I know. I've raced in the circuits in/on some machine or another. I can do Lakeside, Oran Park, Phillip Is, QR, Sandown... the old Surfers Paradise raceway (replete with seashell topmix surface around the back =), knowing what I'd expect to happen in a real car on those exact tracks, and judge the sim from that vantage point. I'm pretty sure when V8SC started with this sim stuff, they were using rFactor. This sort of sim driving, is different from fantasy or sim 'games' where accuracy of the simulation has been compromised to make this more playable. Not that one can actually do this...but for instance, a hot lap around Mt Panorama in rFactor is one thing ; it would be considerably harder to pull off the same lap time in LFS, because live for speed is uncompromising when it comes to simulation accuracy.

    Practical demo.... Oran Park in a Porsche 911 real ..




    Same thing in iRacing ..




    All your visual driving feedback, is defined by the rendering of the track and scenery, relative to the windscreen/edge of windscreen frame. If that doesn't match my seat of the pants experience, the sim loses cred with me.

    The, we have folks who watch motorsports, who have no aspirations to actually participate in that sport, so to them these things are 'entertainment'... real life or not. They possibly don't care about nor wish to understand anything I've typed above, and that's cool..not everyone who fills the MCG at finals time plays aussie rules, do they? Spectators are like this, all sports....and given the last I forget how many years now that F1 has been boring & processional, in sheer entertainment value, Esports... or more particularly Eracing, is actually more entertaining than what we've been seeing in real life, nor is that surprising. For instance, without the fear of certain death, you can actually go harder at a circuit than you would in real life.

    Also, the penalty system works better in the simulated world ~ you stuff up trying too hard in a sim and take someone out (easy to do), you get a say 10second penalty and automagically in a blink your car is 10secs back relative to the rest of the field. Just wtf they haven't implemented something like this in real life...like in Formula-E where you have a drivethru lane to get powerboost, or rallyX where you have a long lap route...ffs, all the tech is there...in F1 all you need is a buslane somewhere around the track, that you have to pass through and FIA controlled signal could force the FIA supplied EMU to knobble the engine to pit speed limiter until the offending car/driver has incurred a 5sec delay in the lap/track time, and then they can go hard at it again. That's probably too bleeding obvious to the numpty lot running the F1 show, which is why I don't follow it I guess.

    What I would like to see this technology do, is bridge the gap between those who watch these sorts of sports, but aren't solely spectators ; I'm talking those folks with innate driving skills that might match or exceed the skills of real life competitors, but for whatever of the myriad of reasons you could cite, will never get to drive the cars they're watching. Sims offer this opportunity, we've already seen this sort of thing going on...but to be done properly, everyone must have access to the same sim software, and that software must render at the same framerate for all players, with the same low framerate jitter..ie; none. You can't achieve that online because lag (I can no longer race online at all because ^&@@^#$& wireless NBN latency). So you have to do it by local time trial, and record you lap time on a ladder/table, and best in the world go to a LAN event to determine who's best, with near as dammit no lag between participant machines & the server.

    Then, right, which is why I've structured this post so, you can get sim experts. I'm not talking sim cheaters/hackers (another interesting story), but those folks out there who actually master the sim software, but may not even have driven a car in their life, let alone something like a F1 weapon. You can easily form a mental picture of some young teenager pinning everyone else to the scenery, including current F1 drivers, not because they're a better driver, but because they know the sim better. Indeed, if you're following what I'm saying here, *not* having any idea of what the real seat of the pants and other tactile feedback a car gives you when driven hard, can be a real bonus in a simulator. If you know track & vehicle very well in real life, it is difficult to push aside the reflex reaction you're brain has already learned about say...going into a corner 10kph faster than you would normally do ; in a sim, you'll try it on... in real life, nah..too close to the edge, don't wanna bin the car...it's hard to overcome.

    The sim software itself is open to exploitation, or folks find interesting things in the physics engine and tell aught about it. At least until others find out how you managed to 'legitimately' post a top laptime. A good example of this, is the fantasy racing simulator TrackMania, and the quest for the holy grail for the best time on A01 ...

    Then... there's driving bots...where all the required inputs needed for any track are executed by a program, and you tweek the params to get it to go faster ; you don't do any driving, you just futz with the control emulator =) I'm a pretty decent sim racer, and that's the opinion of others who've raced against me. When they ask 'what wheel setup are you using?', you can almost hear them all spit out their coffee, when I say I'm using an xbox controller (throttle on right trigger, gearbox on button that side, brakes on left trigger, steering on left joy)..and running the win32 binary with wine on linux =) Sounds like a weird input config, but if you've got years of roadbike under your belt, that actually works pretty well.

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    ..ha, guess who else uses an xbox controller...


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