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Thread: Internally cooled chips

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    Default Internally cooled chips

    A Swiss team has created tiny, fluid-filled channels in microchips to spirit away heat and save energy

    see

    Over the years, embedding liquid cooling in chips has been explored through three basic designs. The first two designs did not bring cooling fluid into direct contact with the chip. One used a cold plate lid with microfluidic channels to cool chips. Another featured a layer of material on the back of chips to transfer heat to a fluid-cooled plate without the lid. The third design, the one that Matioli and his team explored, brings the coolant into direct contact with the chip.

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    My scientific knowledge is severely limited, but it would seem to me that the heat (energy) still has to go somewhere to be dissipated....

    I'm thinking something like a sublimator in a space suit...
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    or perhaps a peltier plate
    are you a self appointed hypocrite sheriff or just a nasty person

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    When I started reading the article, I saw reference to 20um channels and immediately knew we weren't talking 'complex' silicon chips that are now getting under 10nm...then after hundred of words of hype, I find;

    To test their concept, the team designed a water-cooled chips, concerting alternating current (AC) into direct current (DC) integrating microchannels filled with water in the same semiconductor substrate.
    The cooling technology has the potential to become a key part of power converters ranging from small devices to electric cars.
    So it's for FULL BRIDGE RECTIFIERS !!!! .....I am SO unexcited =) [apologies to Electroboom =^]

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    A Swiss team has created tiny, fluid-filled channels in microchips to spirit away heat and save energy
    Ummm, no.
    If you are removing heat, you are removing wasted energy not saving it at all.
    The achievement would be in making the components have a better efficiency, not just have them run cooler through external dissipation.
    In MOSFET's, the older ones produce much more heat for the power they handle than the new ones which waste less power as heat and are much more efficent.

    I can make any component run cooler just by putting a bigger or more efficient heat sink on the thing or a fan. Just because it is running cooler does not mean it's saving energy or is more efficient. That's a complete crock.

    Seems like another beat up story probably as a promotional piece to lure in investors whom are too lazy to do their homework.

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    Interesting reading this again, it has reminded me that the more things change the more they stay the same.

    Many years ago I visited the ABC transmitter site at Bald Hills Brisbane, they had a number of transmitters there including two shortwave transmitters, VLM and VLQ the final output valves were water cooled, with the distilled water actually flowing thru part of the valve. I remember seeing a meter that measured the leakage current thru the water, which rose if the distilled water became polluted with mineral from the electrodes in the valve. If I remember correctly too high a reading require the distilled water to be changed.

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    That's a bit like the way I work with CCD's.
    We put them in a vacuum to thermally isolate them.
    Then we cool them down to 140K.
    Then we heat them up to 144K with a small heater.

    If we lose the vacuum, and by this I mean a change from 1e-6 Torr up to 1e-4 Torr (1 MilliTorr) then the shit hits the fan so to speak and we have to pump it down again with a turbo molecular vacuum pump.

    So while cool it down just to heat it up. We can keep the CCD precisely thermally stable for the best light sensitivity.
    An going from 1 millionth of nothing to 1 thousandth of nothing makes a difference?
    Well yes.Because while both levels are good vacuums but ordinary people sense. Down at the molecular level, 1000 time more atoms flying around is enough to carry heat from the container walls to the CCD cooling and warm it up quicker than we can cool it down.


    or perhaps a peltier plate
    Peltiers actually warm things up. They obey the laws of thermodynamics very well. They also illustrate Maxwell's demon in quantum physics too.
    So a simple description. A peltier takes energy from one side of the device and moves it to the other. If we lower one side by 10 degrees it raises the other side by 10 degrees.
    So at room temperature of 20 degrees we might see the cool side at 10 deg and the hot side at 30 deg. And that would be theoretically true. But reality can't be ignored and the laws of thermodynamics say, "There's no free lunch" Somebody has to pay for the work done moving that heat. And the result of doing work is more heat. So the cool side might be 12 deg while the hot side is 32 deg.
    Leaving the fridge door open doesn't cool the room It makes the room hotter.
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    Quote Originally Posted by george65 View Post
    Ummm, no.
    If you are removing heat, you are removing wasted energy not saving it at all.
    The achievement would be in making the components have a better efficiency, not just have them run cooler through external dissipation.
    In MOSFET's, the older ones produce much more heat for the power they handle than the new ones which waste less power as heat and are much more efficent.
    It is not that straight forward and seeing you are mentioning MOSFETs, in that case they are correct.
    The MOSFET on-resistance has a positive temperature coefficient, which means this resistance is lower when it runs cooler and this does save energy.
    So if we are looking at power MOSFETs or a large array of them in an integrated circuit this saving can be significant.

    The forward voltage drop of standard diode however reduces when it gets warmer. So it might be better to run them a bit hot.
    This era of thoughtless consumption must end so we can encourage a world of creative geniuses rather than consumer idiots.


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