Reply With Quoteeaglem (14-02-23)
Extensive Study Finds Masks Useless
As usual, hysteria won. Even now, as my wife undergoes radiation and chemo, we have to put on one of those bullsh!t blue things before we are allowed in the door....
Today, still, after the vast bulk of Americans has sheepishly consigned masks to the bin, school students in Michigan and Massachusetts are required to mask up in class, despite mounting evidence that masks stunt childhood development.
In that context, a new, rigorous study that found masks did nothing to slow Covid-19 might have made the news. But no; a 305-page Cochrane analysis published globally on January 30 that assessed 78 high-quality scientific studies that included more than 610,000 participants has yet to rate a single mention in The Washington Post, The New York Times or on CNN, for instance.
Even passionate maskers, such as Baltimore epidemiologist Jennifer Nuzzo, conceded Cochrane reviews were the “gold standard” of evidence-based medicine and its latest mask study “a very serious undertaking”.
Cochrane found that surgical masks, the kind doctors wear in operating theatres to avoid accidentally sneezing into an open wound, did nothing to stop Covid-19.
More embarrassing for Team Mask, those even more uncomfortable N95 masks made little to no difference either. Only hand washing seemed to work to prevent the spread of corona and influenza-like viruses.
“There is just no evidence masks make any difference. Full stop,” University of Oxford associate tutor Tom Jefferson, one of the study’s 12 authors, told Australian journalist Maryanne Demasi last week.
“In the absence of evidence, you shouldn’t be forcing anybody to do so,” he said, describing advocates of forced masking as “activists, not scientists”.
It turns out the billions upon billions of masks that were manufactured in response to government mandates and now are floating in oceans or piling up at rubbish tips were likely to have been a colossal waste. American multinational 3M alone produced 4.5 billion N95 masks in 2020 and 2021, according to Statista; the mind boggles at what the global total for all masks might be.
“Governments completely failed to do the right thing and demand better evidence,” Jefferson says. “At the beginning of the pandemic there were some voices who said masks did not work and then suddenly the narrative changed.”
Thankfully, the narrative is changing again, in part to a US House of Representatives Repub#lican majority that is determined to probe some of the madder aspects of the great madness.
“I had doctors who spent years in medicine telling me masks were not effective, and yet these were being forced on people and school kids,” Republican congressman Gary Palmer said last week at a congressional hearing that included US Centres for Disease Control and Prevention director Rochelle Walensky. “We’re seeing a devastating impact on their educational attainment, so it surprises me that the CDC didn’t do any follow-up testing even while this was going on.”
FAmerican multinational 3M alone produced 4.5 billion N95 masks in 2020 and 2021, according to Statista. Picture: AFP
FAmerican multinational 3M alone produced 4.5 billion N95 masks in 2020 and 2021, according to Statista. Picture: AFP
Surprisingly, no government health agency in the US or elsewhere bothered to conduct any randomised control trial of what was a highly divisive intervention that pre-2020 science had counselled against.
Walensky said she didn’t rate the latest Cochrane study because it analysed only the highest quality mask studies. “I’m not sure anybody would have proposed a clinical trial because so many studies demonstrated time and time again … masks were working,” she said in reply, referring to studies that would have been deemed junk before 2020.
Indeed, none of the findings in the latest Cochrane review should have been a surprise. The overwhelming consensus among scientists pre-Covid-19 was that forcing healthy people to wear masks, let alone outside, was pointless and potentially harmful. Minuscule viruses would slip through the tiny holes in the masks or simply go around them.
As late as March 31, 2020, the World Health Organisation was sticking to the old science.
“There is no specific evidence to suggest that the wearing of masks by the mass population has any potential benefit. In fact, there’s some evidence to suggest the opposite in the misuse of wearing a mask properly or fitting it properly,” WHO health emergencies program executive director Mike Ryan told journalists.
But a few weeks later, following a total of zero new studies, “the science” had emerged in all its authoritarian glory, deeming masks effective and forcing them on hundreds of millions of people against their will for up to two years. Masks might have failed totally at stopping Covid-19 surges in every nation that implemented them, but they were highly successful on one metric: stoking fear, providing an in-your-face, everyday reminder of the pandemic that might increase compliance with other measures.
At the same time the incentive structure for researchers, who previously had toiled largely in obscurity, changed dramatically in the first half of 2020. Fame, speaking fees, academic promotion – all were in the offing for the canny researcher who could help demonise anyone who pointed to pre-2020 science or simply preferred to risk getting a bad cold rather than wear a mask.
Governments and their media cheer squad were eager to promote studies that vindicated mandatory masking.
That’s what explains the contemptible silence following the latest Cochrane review.
Wearing a mask sent a powerful message throughout the pandemic: I follow the science. Increasingly, it’s sending a different one: I’m a credulous goose. Or perhaps even, following new research in Frontiers in Psychology published last month: I’m not very attractive.
“Our results consistently demonstrated that self-perceived unattractive individuals were more willing to wear a mask, as they believed it would benefit their attractiveness,” the authors concluded.
To be sure, it wasn’t a randomised control trial but it reveals at least as much truth as any post-2020 study telling you masks worked.
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
eaglem (14-02-23)
| Look Here -> |
Hmmm Murdoch press
There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"
Uncle Fester (13-02-23)
What a typical load of rightwing "oh it impedes our freedom" crock, yawn.
Any form of cover is plain common sense and logic.
So, enf you would be happy if as surgeon wouldn't wear any mask at all before he cuts you up?
Or do you like sputum splattered over you when somebody sneezes?
Masks may not STOP the spread of disease but even the past polite thing that people did when they coughed or sneezed: to cover the mouth, would help reduce the spread of any virus and bacteria to some extent, provided they didn't shake your hand afterwards.
Anyhow there are plenty of independent tests to show that P2, N95 respirators do indeed mostly filter out the tiny aerosol droplets that the virus latches on, if worn correctly.
Last edited by Uncle Fester; 13-02-23 at 12:34 PM.
Update: A deletion of features that work well and ain't broke but are deemed outdated in order to add things that are up to date and broken.
Compatibility: A word soon to be deleted from our dictionaries as it is outdated.
Humans: Entities that are not only outdated but broken... AI-self-learning-update-error...terminate...terminate...
Just pointing out that's not an accurate analogy ~ when a surgeon cuts you up, they are breaching the human body's prime layer of protection...the epidermal layers...ie; stuff we call skin....and in that case it's the cleanliness of the operating theatre, and all surgical equipment that matters just as much (or more so) than the surgeon/assistants donning their masks.So, enf you would be happy if as surgeon wouldn't wear any mask at all before he cuts you up?
I think it goes without saying that equipment and theatre are kept as sterile as possible but you can't sterilise the respiratory organs including mouth and nose of the surgeon and assistants.Originally Posted by wotnot
So I would find it important to provide at least a rudimentary barrier, especially once the epidermis is breached.
Of course after reading 'The Australian' all medical staff can now liberate themselves from masks and happily spray and cough microbes into an open wound:
Last edited by Uncle Fester; 13-02-23 at 04:11 PM.
Update: A deletion of features that work well and ain't broke but are deemed outdated in order to add things that are up to date and broken.
Compatibility: A word soon to be deleted from our dictionaries as it is outdated.
Humans: Entities that are not only outdated but broken... AI-self-learning-update-error...terminate...terminate...
"Even now, as my wife undergoes radiation and chemo"
Enf, RUOK, it is important to keep the mob up to date re your wife, I am sure every one on here is very supportive
After going through a similar experience in the last 3 months you will be surprised the amount of support that is out there, some times too much!
Start your own thread to keep every one updated
Wish you and your wife the best out come
Last edited by allover; 13-02-23 at 04:05 PM.
There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"
drummerboy (14-02-23)
This study refutes festers ideas...ie..it MUST be right wing...FFS.
THAT'S the point of the study, not you're rationalisations. I'd suggest that pro masker epidemiologist Jennifer Nuzzo, has a little more credibility than you. The "gold standard" she said.Even passionate maskers, such as Baltimore epidemiologist Jennifer Nuzzo, conceded Cochrane reviews were the “gold standard” of evidence-based medicine and its latest mask study “a very serious undertaking”.
Cochrane found that surgical masks, the kind doctors wear in operating theatres to avoid accidentally sneezing into an open wound, did nothing to stop Covid-19.
jeez..you're an open book...
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Hang on...in allovers Ukraine post, you made this statement...jeeez...hahhaha.
Well...it would appear not wouldn't it....sigh!! Like I said, an open book.Sorry, I don't bother watching youtube opinions anymore, like all social media, just full of BS.
I only go to Youtube for music and Sabine Hossenfelder.
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
.
Oh dear...A little low, even for you. Although you may be right, I'll think about it.
The point is that we are being forced by a respected cancer clinic to wear these useless things, not my wifes condition....she was declared free of cancer after the operation, and is doing this as the "killshot" according to her surgeon. I hardly need sympathy...I'm pretty happy...
A little sad that you would play that insult card....surprised? no unfortunately....
You're surname isn't Milligan is it?
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
To make my point I needed a graphical image that displays the scientific fact that aerosols are expelled even when people talk.
That was the first one I came up with.
It is not my fault that Google practically has the monopoly on all things video.
I only noticed Fauci's comment after the demonstration. That spoilt neutrality and was not my intention.
Update: A deletion of features that work well and ain't broke but are deemed outdated in order to add things that are up to date and broken.
Compatibility: A word soon to be deleted from our dictionaries as it is outdated.
Humans: Entities that are not only outdated but broken... AI-self-learning-update-error...terminate...terminate...
Not my ideas.
There are plenty of proper studies out there that prove that P2, N95 masks filter said aerosols.
I don't know whatever (possibly political?) reason Jennifer Nuzzo may have said that but "gold standard" ? ... already raises a red flag.
Sounds like a TV or internet ad for some skin cream or something.
For you everything that is published on "The Australian" is gold standard anyhow, so I will leave you with your beliefs.
Fester out.
Update: A deletion of features that work well and ain't broke but are deemed outdated in order to add things that are up to date and broken.
Compatibility: A word soon to be deleted from our dictionaries as it is outdated.
Humans: Entities that are not only outdated but broken... AI-self-learning-update-error...terminate...terminate...
"Gold Standard" is the term used by PRO MASK epidemiologist Jennifer Nuzzo, not me, not the Australian....Tell the truth hey, or more importantly, READ the article rather than jump to the hysterical.
"Proper Studies"....."Independent Studies"......FFS...proper how? Independent of what or whom?
ANYTHING that agrees with you is proper and independent.....that's the way it seems to me anyway....
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Forget about how much masks can stop covid for a second. Think about what happens in a large scale.
If masks stop viral transmission then think about which viruses are stopped. There is no specific mask that can filter our corona virus only and letting through millions of other viruses which might be very essential for our health.
By constantly wearing masks we are turning into sterile organisms or organisms with deficiencies.
Viruses are good for us, without them we wouldn't exist.
I have no problems with people who feel they need extra protection due to their vulnerability. I have problems with people who force me to wear the mask I don't need.
I just shake my head, not even worth a reply!.
Oh dear...A little low, even for you. Although you may be right, I'll think about it.
The point is that we are being forced by a respected cancer clinic to wear these useless things, not my wifes condition....she was declared free of cancer after the operation, and is doing this as the "killshot" according to her surgeon. I hardly need sympathy...I'm pretty happy...
A little sad that you would play that insult card....surprised? no unfortunately....
You're surname isn't Milligan is it?
There is a fine line between "Hobby" and "Madness"
drummerboy (14-02-23)
There isn't one is there? Not that would fit your post.
Like I said...low...a shame really.
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Extensive Study Finds Masks Useless
That report indicates there is little/no benefit to the mass population of healthy people in outdoor or open settings wearing masks, however it doesn’t comment on medical settings and or/people who are medically compromised and more prone to serious affects from COVID.
To the contrary, the indication is that mask wearing in a medical/health environment, or by immune-compromised members of society, can be of benefit.
So while I hope all goes well for you wife, the medical condition she is receiving treatment for, and the clinical setting that you find yourself in, lends itself to continuing to wear a mask to assist in preventing the spread of COVID in people who are more prone to getting seriously ill from the virus.
Last edited by peteramjet; 14-02-23 at 05:30 AM.
Of course you wear a mask in a medical institution. Trouble is I have to take my properly made sealed mask with TWO filters off and put on a blue spittle mask to enter the building. THAT is my point. They say it's because their masks are a "known item"....
Mandatory mask wearing in public open spaces accomplished nothing.
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news on this one enf, but this one is bullshit and it has been mis-interpreted and you're suffering from some serious confirmation bias.
Rather than type out all the references and links and evidence which is a lot of work, Steve Novella has done a good analysis of it on the SGU podcast.
The item in question is about 5-10 minutes in.
Yes I am an agent of Satan, but my duties are largely ceremonial.
Jeeez...don't be sorry...confirmation bias (love that term) is common here and I'm no different....
The fact that there's a highway to hell and a stairway to heaven says a lot about the anticipated traffic flow.
The MAYO Clinic in America is an authoritative source for all required health information, including Covid 19 and acceptable face masks.
Their home page is at
For face masks see
The World Health Organisation is also a very good site.
For Covid 19 see
Last edited by tristen; 26-02-23 at 01:52 PM. Reason: Additional info
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks