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Thread: Rear Rocker Cover Gasket

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    Default Rear Rocker Cover Gasket

    Ok all its my rocker cover gasket that fukd up! ok how long does this take to change guys its the rear one. Could i do this myself i have all the tools is it easy to do?wat do you guys think? oh yea its for a V6 Mitsubishi FTO



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    fto, ive done a few rocker box gaskets, but never on an FTO. Shouldnt be that hard really

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTO King View Post
    Ok all its my rocker cover gasket that fukd up! ok how long does this take to change guys its the rear one. Could i do this myself i have all the tools is it easy to do?wat do you guys think? oh yea its for a V6 Mitsubishi FTO
    ok im going to do this myself is there anyhting i should know before doing it?anyone know where to get he gasket from besides mitsubishi?Also i know that you need to put liquid gasket under the gasket is this right?And finally what about surface preperation after i remove the old gasket should i thouurougly clean both contact surfaces?Also how tight hsould the bolts be that bolt down on it to the point where itwo nt budge anymore or just reasonably tight??

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    It is quite simple remove the rocker cover, you may as well do both if you are going to do it, remove the old gasket, clean both surfaces (Rocker Cover and Cylinder Head) replace the rocker cover and tighten the bolts to the factory recommended torque (found in the service manual).

    Do not over tighten bolts, and tighten bolts alternating to the opposite of the bolt you are working on.

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    Senior Member global88's Avatar
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    Hi Fto king, lucky you its only your rocker cover gasket.

    Yes you better do it yourself, or ill be after you. LOL

    A good job to start learning the next steps.

    One thing id suggest if its your first time, is that if the rear cover is leaking chances are your front one may also be on the way out.

    Id take advantage of this and FIRST do the front one because its easyer to do and you can see and learn more before doing the rear one.

    The difficult part on the rear one is that its probably very close to the firewall making work a little difficult.

    Make sure you do it when the engines cold, nothing worse that burnt forearms when reaching into hard to get places like behind the efi manifold.

    Ok some examples to give you an idea......
    To remove the rocker cover you have to identify whats connected to it (hoses and brackets), anything in the way when lifting it, any wires that may need to be temporaraly moved out of the way (like ignition leads) and which screws or bolts are holding it down.

    First lets start with a 2002 camry
    This is the rocker cover gasket(where my fingers pointing). The cast aluminium cover above the black gasket line is the rocker cover.

    There are no visable bolts holding it down. To find the bolts, all the sparkplug leads need to be removed and some large nuts (4, one for each sparkplug lead) can be seen and removed.

    In this pic you can see a curve type shape in the metal inside the gap, under my thumb. Take note of it, more on this later.

    Second is my HKS GTR Nur spec engine.
    Very hard to see the gasket because its under hoses, twin turbo manifold, efi, etc etc...
    Very easy to get to, just undo any hoses connected and move afew wires out of the way. The rocket cover is held down by phillips head screws with large washers. Here you can see one near my finger, easy to reach with a screw driver.

    Ok last one is a Ford straight 6.
    Probably best to show with.
    The gasket im pointing at looks pretty thick. Its not, its cup shaped like a upside down U. Note all the sparkplug leads. They have to be numbered, unpluged and placed out of the way. Also note the sealed curved nuts onto of the rocker cover. The washer under them has a rubber gasket also.

    Ok so you removed all wires (not like in this pic) and now disconnect all your hoses like this one

    And this one

    Now you can undo all the nuts holding the cover down. Undo them progressivly, a little each, equaly untill their all undone. This is important so you dont warp your rocker cover. Also note if you have gaskets under you nuts or screws.

    Now to remove the rockercover you may have to tap it a little and or pry it off with a screw driver. BE CAREFULL! Work gently, pry a little all round, remember aluminium is soft and easy to scratch. Dont panic if you do, you can emery any high points down and silicon any very deep low points. Point is you want to minimise any damage.
    Now remove the old gasket and clean both the clyinder head and rocket cover joint surfaces. Inspect the joining surfaces and remove any impefections.
    Assembly is pretty much the opposite of what you just did.
    End Part1

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    Senior Member global88's Avatar
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    Part2;
    Remember the curved surface in one of the Camry pics is asked you to note?
    Here is its Ford counterpart.

    The point im pointing at, the curve is a known leakage point on all engines.
    The way the cover presses down on the gasket and the sharp corner is a well know leak. MAKE SURE you use some quality silicon all around this curved area!
    Put your cover back on and evenly tighten all the nuts in stages so you dont warp your cover.
    Some engines use a cork gasket instead of rubber.
    On cork gaskets, coat them with a quality non hardening sealant before assembly.

    The top tube is silicon that i use on sharp corners and the bottom bottle is number 3 aviation non hardening gasket glue for cork and paper gaskets.

    As i said do the front one first to build your confidence, then do the rear one.
    Cheers

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    yepp its a cork gasket mate..so i take it get gasket glue to keep it in place andnon hardening silicon on all the sharp edges etc to stop leaking points?what do i ask for at autobarn mate..also is it worth getting a torque wrench?it states in the workshop manual 4NM of torque how tight is this?

    hoesntly golbal88 your a legend mate a great help if i knew your address id send you a bunch of flowers thank you so much amte i appreciate it alot thankyou...and wit hthe moeny i save from this ill buy myself some heavy duty stands etc liek you said

    thanks alot !!!!!

    Farah

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    Get a bottle of "Loctite Number3 non hardening sealant, avation gasket sealant"(as written on the bottle) and a tube of "Dyna grip rtv silicon gasket maker" for any sharp points that may leak(infact any good silicon gasket maker like Loctite silicon).

    4nm is not very tight.

    If you need a torque wrench PM me and you can use mine for a week if you want. Its just sitting here doing nothing.

    Dont send flowers.
    My wife would probably bash me.

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    ok mad ill buy some tomorrow morning from autobarn mitsubishi wanted 90 dollars for a 100g tube of 3M liquid gasket.....

    do you think i should change the rear sparkies while im there...what about the fuel filter is it worth doing?hasnt been done in a 100000km/ hard to do mate?

    haha ill send you a bottle of black label whiskey how does that sound better ?

    tomorrow ill go in to atobarn and see if i can get a torque wrench for a good price if i can ill buy it sineill be using it a fair bit if not il lsend you a pm..

    once again global i really appreciate all your help thankyou so miuch youve saved me a fair few dollars

    cheers

    Farah

    P.S oh yea this is what the workshop manual says in terms of the liquid gasket...



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    Whoa hold on mate, dont start tearing your engine apart yet.

    Start one job at a time, finish it, test it before starting the next one.

    Im sure if you take your time and are careful you could change your plugs and filters without any problems.

    The torque wrench is here if you want to save a $ any time.

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    Just saw the diagrams, looks shit easy.

    Yep thats silicon on the corners.

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    well..i called mitsubishi australia and ordered two rocker cover gaskets for 60 dollars each.And they also told me to use permatex ultra blue as the silicon for teh job and to put a thin layer all aroudn the head.Ther ysaisd they use this for all eviolutions etc. I also checked my service history and the spark plugs (which i know how to change) and the leads (also know how to do) hadnt been changed in 80000km so since im behind the intake manifold and the rocker cover is of i might as well do the sparks and the leads ah well.

    i know watchya going to say global dont get ahead of yourself i know lol but i have a question for you mate by tappets are noisy and need to be adjusted it doesnt look to hard but im not sure lots of people over on the ftoaustralia forum have done it and said its quite easy but im not sure....Since the rocker covers will be off hmmmm watchya think mate check out this link btw?


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    A very good link you posted, even shows your rocker cover job.

    I noted in one of the posts that someone mentioned the rocker cover gasket was rubber, not cork.
    If you have the option get the rubber one.
    The permatex blue silicon is perfect for the job.

    I looked at the valve adjustment and i dont want to discourage you but the mivec system may be a little difficult for a begineer.

    That does not mean you should not try.
    This is how you will learn.

    The spanner for a start must be a 10mm tube with the side ground out of it for clearance.
    If you dont have this or cant build one, dont even attempt it.
    The tube spanner must be operated by a ring spanner and a screw driver is passed through the middle to adjust the screw. ie tube spanner unlocks the nut while screw driver adjusts the screw, then you hold the correct gap screw position with the screwdriver while locking the new position with the tube spanner.
    You have 24 adjustments to make in very little space, specially the rear ones.
    The rear bank exhaust valves are going to drive you nuts, specially when its your first time.

    If you could build the modified tube spanner, try the front head to see how you go.
    Remember it the rear that going to be difficult.

    Do your spark plugs, but my personal experiance with jap ignition leads is that they last alot longer than you would belive.
    If your going to put aftermarket ones, i say dont do it, they dont last anywhere as long as the factory ones. The factory ones are NOT cheap.

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    yep got the permatex ultra blue i got some Top Gun leads to itwil llast 40000 km at leastand i got some sparks allaround hmmm tappets sound hard but i really want to do it lol really badly hey quick question global88 the guy at mitsu said to put the permatex ultra blue all around the head so not jsut on corners but on the whole thing does this sound right mate?

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    No it dont sound right for a rubber gasket, but NO harm.

    For a cork one its a good idea. Thats why i use the aviation non hardening glue on the cork ones but silicon is also ok.

    Do your front cover first and have a go at you valve adjustment.

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    What a fascinating thread...

    Cork seals it'self with compression. If you squish it between 2 hard surfaces it becomes water tight and WILL NOT LEAK under normal automotive use. Think wine bottle here, they don't use silicon in a wine bottle do they???

    Using any form of silicon goop with a cork gasket will ruin the nice flat cork seal and actually create imperfections in the seal, causing it to leak later on.
    I don't recommend it.

    You should use one method or the other, don't combine them!

    Most modern engines have a groove machined or molded into the mating surfaces of adjoining components. The idea is that if you ever remove a part or break the seal, you scrape off the goo, and when you re-fit it, you use a silicon gasket maker compound of some sort to fill the groove with ONE continuous bead of silicon all the way around the component, put it in place and do up the bolts.

    The type of silicone is not terribly important, even a $4 tube of clear silicone from the hardware store will do the job, since silicon is impervious to water, oil and heat up to something crazy like 800 degrees, you can use silicon to build an entire engine and it will not leak or burn through the seal, you can even use silicone on exhaust pipes and manifolds.

    The best method of installing car parts with silicon is to make a non-stop bead all the way around, don't smooth it off, just leave it round so there is some silicon sticking up from the edge, put the component in place without slipping and sliding around, do up the bolts till the silicon JUST starts to compress a little and is touching both surfaces, leave it for an hour and then come back and do them up tight.

    For a rocker cover though, some of them have large semi-circle shapes carved out at the ends of the head so you can undo the cam shafts, etc so if this is the case then go with the gasket, if these aren't there then you can use silicon only.

    Also, regarding the torque wrench, this is not critically important that you torque the bolts up to a specific tightness. It is very possible to do more harm than good by using a badly calibrated torque wrench or using it the wrong way. I suggest for a rocker cover, the "do 'em up till they are tight" method will be quite satisfactory.

    For the record, using a 1/2" drive ratchet that has a handle that is approx 8-10 inches long, a normal average strength bloke could pull about 50ft/lb of torque on the bolts if you want to put it in numbers.

    50 ft/lb is the same hanging 50 pounds of weight off the end of a 1 foot long handle on your socket.

    While i'm at it, if there are any HARD TO GET AT spark plugs and you intend on changing them, use platinum plugs or iridiums so you don't have to do it as often.

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    Big george check the mitsubishi factory recomended method posted by Ftoking.

    Its the same method i recomended, its a well known fact that all gaskets have problems sealing in corners such as cam cut outs.

    How did i know?
    All engines that ive rebuilt or serviced recomend the same thing.

    Remember that a corner or 90degree bend does not have the same compression as a flat surface.

    Tightening with a torque wrench is important on a rocker cover for a beginer. Ive spent my fair share of time helicoiling striped threads from people not using one. If he strips a thread it will cost him considrably more than the cost of a torque wrench. Remember the head is aluminium and its his first time.

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    I get my gaskets tomorrow and just havea few quick questions....

    1) what do you use to clean the head of the engine liek to remove the old gasket goo?

    2)Does the rocker cover need to be cleaned(the udnerside that touches the gasket)?

    3)Should i do what mitsubishi say and put the liquid gasket around the whole head or just where it says in the workshop manual (see above).

    4)in terms of the torque wrench i couldnt find anywhere that had one that does 4 newton/Meters..I was thinking that mayby tigthen the bolts up finger tight and then give them all a quater turn with a 1/4 rachet?What do you think global88?

    5) And for puting the new gasket on do i put the silicon straight on the head in the selected area(s) and then put the gasket straight on top and then oput the rocker coveron top and tighten?does this sound right?

    6) And for adjusting the engine tappets i jsut want to confirm which bank(s) of valves are the intake and which are the exhaust.Is what i have in the diagram correct(see below)


    Oh yea sorry abotu all the questions i jsut really want to learn and do it right.
    thanks in advance global88
    appreciate it alot

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    1/ I use a scraper, stanley knife blade. try not to dig into the Aluminium too much. Some times i use a little steel wool. Dont get anything into the engine, specialy the steel wool, not good.

    2/ All contacting surfaces need to be cleaned. The gasket needs a straight, impefection free contact on both sides (head and cover) to make a good seal.

    3/ What the workshop manual shows is the correct method. What Mitsubishi recommended is safer, it covers their arses just incase one of their mechanics has a bent cover or some damage on one of the surfaces. Just wipe off the excess that will sqiuze out.

    4/Torque wrench settings can be converted on line. This is what i do. I dont think 1/4 of a turn is enough, just tighten them firmly but dont hang off the spanner incase you strip your threads.
    As i said you could use mine if your worried.

    5/ I coat the gasket, wait a few minutes for it to skin, then assembel.
    When i dont have a gasket i apply a continuos bead around the head, running the bead around the INSIDE of any bolt holes, let it skin, then assemble.
    I dont think it makes a diffrence which way you go, but considering you have a cork gasket (flimsy) it would be easyer to coat the aluminium surfaces and not the gasket. Same thing, look what easyer for you (and less chance of touching the silicon and distubing it if you put it on the head and cover).

    6/ The valves can be followed to be identify them. On a v6 the intake manifold sits in the middle of the v. If you follow the pipes they lead to the intake valves (the uppermost inboard position). They should all run off the same cam shaft.
    The exhaust valves should all be on the opposite camshart. This camshart is on the same side as your exhaust pipes/ exhaust manifold.
    The position and procedure can be confirmed in you pdf manual.
    Your diagram IS correct assuming the red lines are outside side of the engine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by global88 View Post
    1/ I use a scraper, stanley knife blade. try not to dig into the Aluminium too much. Some times i use a little steel wool. Dont get anything into the engine, specialy the steel wool, not good.

    2/ All contacting surfaces need to be cleaned. The gasket needs a straight, impefection free contact on both sides (head and cover) to make a good seal.

    3/ What the workshop manual shows is the correct method. What Mitsubishi recommended is safer, it covers their arses just incase one of their mechanics has a bent cover or some damage on one of the surfaces. Just wipe off the excess that will sqiuze out.

    4/Torque wrench settings can be converted on line. This is what i do. I dont think 1/4 of a turn is enough, just tighten them firmly but dont hang off the spanner incase you strip your threads.
    As i said you could use mine if your worried.

    5/ I coat the gasket, wait a few minutes for it to skin, then assembel.
    When i dont have a gasket i apply a continuos bead around the head, running the bead around the INSIDE of any bolt holes, let it skin, then assemble.
    I dont think it makes a diffrence which way you go, but considering you have a cork gasket (flimsy) it would be easyer to coat the aluminium surfaces and not the gasket. Same thing, look what easyer for you (and less chance of touching the silicon and distubing it if you put it on the head and cover).

    6/ The valves can be followed to be identify them. On a v6 the intake manifold sits in the middle of the v. If you follow the pipes they lead to the intake valves (the uppermost inboard position). They should all run off the same cam shaft.
    The exhaust valves should all be on the opposite camshart. This camshart is on the same side as your exhaust pipes/ exhaust manifold.
    The position and procedure can be confirmed in you pdf manual.
    Your diagram IS correct assuming the red lines are outside side of the engine.

    ok thanks global88 just a got a couple of questions in regards to what you said:

    im pretty sure well (90%) sure the gasket coming fromt mitsubishi is a rubber gasket:

    1:im using the permatexultra blue mate and it says as soon as yo apply to quickly assemple everything.So tell me if this method is correct:

    a) clean everything
    b) apply the permatex ultra blue around the whole head of the engine and around the bolt holes and inside the bolt hole and do it as one continuous bead so that means cut the nozzle of the permatex ultra blue at the first noch for firstbead right? and it should be roughly 3mm thick?
    c)put on gasket and let it sit
    d)Do i need to put the permatex ultra blue on top of the gasket as in the surface that makes contact with the rocker cover as well?
    e) do the above step but the rocker cover back on andtighten until firm any liquid gasket that oozes a bit to the side clean up (What if it oozes in to the engine can this happen or does it happen only if you ut to much?
    What does let it skin mean mate?

    And finally do i need to come back a hour later and re tighten?

    Oh yeah and to clean the engine the side of it do i just use a rag can i put any ligquid or anyhting on the rag?

    thankyou and im sorryfor being a pain with all the questions globall88 i hope one day i can repay the favour
    Farah

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