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Thread: Smart Meters - Consumer Electricity Metering

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    Default Smart Meters - Consumer Electricity Metering

    Well, today for the first time, i heard about the roll out of Smart Meters throughout Victoria.
    Seems it has been mandated by the Victorian Government.




    The Victorian government has mandated that all manually-read electricity meters in the state be replaced with new remotely-read interval “smart meters”. This world leading technology will ultimately empower you to better manage your energy needs and increase retail competition. The new smart meters will remain property of CitiPower and Powercor, as they comprise part of the distribution network that supplies your power.

    Smart meter infrastructure provides a new way of measuring and managing electricity consumption. It involves two important elements:

    a meter that remotely captures half hour electricity consumption data

    a two way communication system that transmits the usage information to CitiPower and Powercor in real time and receives control instructions.

    Victoria is among the first places in the world to begin a roll out of smart meters to all electricity consumers. There is world-wide interest in smart meter technology and roll outs are being planned or getting underway in many countries including the United States, Canada, Italy, Sweden and New Zealand


    Wow in the years they have been talking about this (some 25 years to my knowledge) it looks like it is finally going to happen.

    This will clearly make it easier for all retailers to have a fair share of the market... as you don't need mater readers from different companys going all over the place.
    But boy.... does this put Big Brother into play!!!



    I wonder what other "hidden" secrets are going to come with these new meters???
    Current limiting perhaps?

    As it stands, most homes in Victoria have an 80amp supply
    In my area, Powercor dropped that back to 40amps per New property some 5 years ago.
    So i wonder if by changing these meters... if they will have internal current limiting devices??

    Most likely not... but who knows?

    Has anyone had their old meter changed over to the new Smart Meter yet?

    Here in Victoria, we haven't ever been able to use Home Automation that relied on signals being sent down your existing home wiring to trigger lights and power points, like they have in Europe... it was always said that the reason for this was one day we would have Smart Metering and they didn't want any chance of interference on the lines.
    At least that is what i was told anyway. Yet it seems they use a different method to get the data back.

    The smart metering system makes use of low power radiofrequency (RF) transmitters to communicate meter readings. Weak RF fields in the 900MHz and 2.4 GHz bands are produced during the system's normal operation. These communications frequencies are well within Australian guidelines, and smart meter RF emissions are less than most other sources in the home such as those produced by mobile phones, cordless phones and wireless routers.



    I was told the work will take 4 years to complete.
    It will be a massive undertaking... I've seen how slow a Powercor worker works.
    And boy, is there going to be a Massive Stock pile of old meters!!!!

    P.S. This might be a timely warning for those that have made their own metering arrangements , to put your wiring back the way you found it
    Last edited by oceanboy; 23-02-10 at 07:19 PM.



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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanboy View Post

    P.S. This might be a timely warning for those that have made their own metering arrangements , to put your wiring back the way you found it
    Maybe post this in Fernbays dope growers justification thread.

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    I realize this site is a "little" biased but here are some of the facts re the new meters.



    Charging more for Electricity is politically more expedient than building new power stations for a growing population. In Victoria the minster responsible Peter Bachelor can't provide any meaningful advantage for the consumer other than (from memory something to this effect) "It will keep the consumer informed and allow them to make informed choices re there energy use"

    Mr. Bachelor is also retiring from parliament at the next election and thus won't be around when consumers find out what he is really talking about and the government having had the November election will be in a fresh 3 year term and not have to worry about the backlash.

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    I forgot to mention a friend who is involve in the water industry told me about the plans for new water meters. These will somehow utilize the same phone home path as the smart meters. Not directly but relaying the flow data and also control data to turn the water off and on via the same data path as the electricity meter.

    At present they have a technical problem the power for the electronics in the meter is provided by a turbine in the water flow which charges a lithium battery. If the consumer does not use enough water then the battery goes flat. The meter is wirelessly connected so there is no mains power. Thus warehouses and vacant flats with for example with little water use are a problem as the meter stops working.

    Smart water meters will allow a variable rate cost structure and the ability to restrict users who fail to honor restrictions.
    Last edited by SystemRat; 23-02-10 at 08:33 PM.

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    We get punished for their incompetence... no dams no power stations... So we have to use less yet the population is going up.. Every summer they cut the power to our street..I know they do it because I have 2 phase and usually only half the house goes off.. Last year on one of the real hot nights they cut it and we had to go and get the old girl across the road and bring her to our place till the power came back on...she's 90... How many will die when they cut power?

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    Quote Originally Posted by godzilla View Post
    maybe post this in fernbays dope growers justification thread.
    lol
    If I want too,I can, I will

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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanboy View Post
    .
    [I]The smart metering system makes use of low power radiofrequency (RF) transmitters to communicate meter readings. Weak RF fields in the 900MHz and 2.4 GHz bands are produced during the system's normal operation.
    I
    P.)
    There is a shitload of stuff on those frequencies. I wonder how immune to corruption the data is?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemRat View Post
    I forgot to mention a friend who is involve in the water industry told me about the plans for new water meters. These will somehow utilize the same phone home path as the smart meters. Not directly but relaying the flow data and also control data to turn the water off and on via the same data path as the electricity meter.

    At present they have a technical problem the power for the electronics in the meter is provided by a turbine in the water flow which charges a lithium battery. If the consumer does not use enough water then the battery goes flat. The meter is wirelessly connected so there is no mains power. Thus warehouses and vacant flats with for example with little water use are a problem as the meter stops working.

    Smart water meters will allow a variable rate cost structure and the ability to restrict users who fail to honor restrictions.
    There is the use of logic for you, their worried that the meters that don't get enough water through them ---> wont be charged up enough to restrict water use through them.
    Last edited by Redwight; 23-02-10 at 11:11 PM. Reason: Spelling is everything.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemRat View Post

    Charging more for Electricity is politically more expedient than building new power stations for a growing population..
    trouble is mate that if they did build more power stations no matter how efficient , the state govt's would charge us more anyway claiming they have to pay for the construction somehow
    there is no such thing as free public infrastructure anymore imo

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    In Victoria Green preferences represent around 10% of the vote.



    Thus we could have had a new dam on the Mitchell river for around $1.3 billion and had 430 giga liters of water extra per year. Instead we are building a hugely expensive desalination plant which will produce 150 giga liters expandable to 200 giga liters.



    The Victorian Greens energy policy.



    The decision to build new base load power stations is balanced against a greater imperative. Remaining in power.
    Last edited by SystemRat; 24-02-10 at 08:46 AM.

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    Time to check my bills. I was just looking at a mates and he has been getting charged for a smart meter......we dont even have them. What a joke.

    They make us pay for the meter ( we pay a service and supply charge...why pay again ? ) which apparently will save them more money. They then sack all the meter readers saving even more !

    What a scam this is. Customers should not have to pay for something that the company should supply free of charge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanity View Post
    Time to check my bills. I was just looking at a mates and he has been getting charged for a smart meter......we dont even have them. What a joke.

    They make us pay for the meter ( we pay a service and supply charge...why pay again ? ) which apparently will save them more money. They then sack all the meter readers saving even more !

    What a scam this is. Customers should not have to pay for something that the company should supply free of charge.

    The same happened here when I had Solar panels put on, I had to buy a smart two-way meter from Western Power. This then begs the question of ownership of the meter, can Western Power still claim to own the meter? I'm sure if you bought a Falcon from Ford they couldn't claim to still own it and it is then yours to do with as you will. Is the meter the same?
    The Eagle Flies High!


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    Good point eaglem

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    Got mine installed last Monday,It looked different,Digital digits instead of old no's with a spinning meter,Have to wait and see how good or bad these meters are.

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    What area do you live CONAXLE (roughly)
    Just wondering where they are starting from?

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    Western suburbs of Melbourne..

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    Thanks mate, did they issue 2 letters like they explained they would?
    Or just turn up to do it?

    I have some jobs i look after and the workers will need a key to gain access by vehicle to the propertys. The meter reader just jumps the gate i think and walks down the long driveway.

    Will be interesting how some of these more remote properties fair with the WiFi connection?
    I see they mention 900Mhz too, so perhaps they jump onto the 3G network? Or maybe it is their own special network just for meter reading?
    Some of the jobs i have been too, are a good distance from any town and have no 3G or NextG coverage... they have to use dial-up or VSAT for internet.
    So i wonder if in these cases, the meter readers will still doing things the old fashioned way?

    I can see the possibility for some massive problems with this WiFi system.

    You can also see what is going to happen for late payments now too.... and i bet they will still charge you $160 to reconnected the supply, even though it just a mouse click back at the office.
    Last edited by oceanboy; 24-02-10 at 01:24 PM.

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    Well, I'd certainly like to know if the Energy relief grant scheme here Victoria will now open up the eligibility to the scheme for all households and not just those that are concession card holders.....I can actually see a situation where some of our most vunerable members in the community will go back to the days of living with no electricity, and honestly it wouldn't take much for people to start doing this.

    ps: might have to invest in an kerosine powered frig & wood stove to heat the hot water
    Democracy & Ignorance = A Winning Combination

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    I have heard of a few bad installtions of these, apparently one lady got a shock from her meterbox or something like that.
    I'm not up to speed on the matter anymore, but people at work have been saying the program might be stopped or you can choose not to have a smart meter fitted??

    Does anyone know anything of this... or is it just talk on the street?

    Thanks

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    Surely there's been someone somewhere in Vic' that has some inside info (like schematics) of these, so called, "smart meters". If not has there been any reverse engineering of one yet? Anyone?

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