VAST and third party recievers

[Xplorer]

UltraPower have assured me his card is working in one of their receivers. But of course I've had many guys saying they can't get their cards going. I did ask him again and have no reason to doubt him. Maybe it's something to do with 5.7 cards and 6.0 cards?? dunno

Leroy

Hoping UP can provide some details when back.

[Xplorer]

Once the card is married to the box there is no hope in using another.

To compound the problem further the cam key algorithm is also completely different which means no softcam or non-certified stb will work

The million dollar questions

So what will happen when other manufacturers release an authorised vast box...

1. Will UEC be forced to somehow unmarry current vast cards, allowing to work within other authorised boxes?
2. When other boxes are available, will we be forced again to only buy as a card and box package deal, or will there be a card only option?
3. Will these new authorised boxes be locked down like current UEC is, or could they be used to receive other channels and sats?
4. If UEC release a PVR box, will current vast cards be unmarried, then remarried and work in new PVR box, or will it require another vast card authorisation?

Realise it's a wait and see, as there are no answers yet. I'm like most of us and frustrated as hell with the woeful quality of this box.
It's small & looks good until you turn it on; but on the other side of things, having more and clearer channels is fantastic.

[Croady]

The million dollar questions

So what will happen when other manufacturers release an authorised vast box...

1. Will UEC be forced to somehow unmarry current vast cards, allowing to work within other authorised boxes?
2. When other boxes are available, will we be forced again to only buy as a card and box package deal, or will there be a card only option?
3. Will these new authorised boxes be locked down like current UEC is, or could they be used to receive other channels and sats?
4. If UEC release a PVR box, will current vast cards be unmarried, then remarried and work in new PVR box, or will it require another vast card authorisation?

Realise it's a wait and see, as there are no answers yet. I'm like most of us and frustrated as hell with the woeful quality of this box.
It's small & looks good until you turn it on; but on the other side of things, having more and clearer channels is fantastic.

The online application I completed did not ask for the box number it just asked for the card number and the box type was in a drop down menu and of course the only one. So the card is married to the UEC Box but not mine specifically?

[earlsdon]

The million dollar questions

................

4. If UEC release a PVR box, will current vast cards be unmarried, then remarried and work in new PVR box, or will it require another vast card authorisation?

............

I understand from a post elsewhere on this forum UEC will be providing a firmware update for the current box to allow it to become a PVR via the existing USB input/outlet (supposed to be at end of this month) - rather than a different box.

[Xplorer]

I understand from a post elsewhere on this forum UEC will be providing a firmware update for the current box to allow it to become a PVR via the existing USB input/outlet (supposed to be at end of this month) - rather than a different box.

If that's the case, then hopefully the update will also iron out the many problems being experienced.

[wxcooper]

i was in touch with uec late last year and they told me that the current box would not be updated and that a new box was in development. why , i don't know when the usb port is already in place and only requiring a firmware update to utilize it.

wxcooper

[Tiny]

i was in touch with uec late last year and they told me that the current box would not be updated and that a new box was in development. why , i don't know when the usb port is already in place and only requiring a firmware update to utilize it.

wxcooper

I may be pessimistic - profit.

[pc9]

The million dollar questions

So what will happen when other manufacturers release an authorised vast box...

1. Will UEC be forced to somehow unmarry current vast cards, allowing to work within other authorised boxes?
2. When other boxes are available, will we be forced again to only buy as a card and box package deal, or will there be a card only option?
3. Will these new authorised boxes be locked down like current UEC is, or could they be used to receive other channels and sats?
4. If UEC release a PVR box, will current vast cards be unmarried, then remarried and work in new PVR box, or will it require another vast card authorisation?

Realise it's a wait and see, as there are no answers yet. I'm like most of us and frustrated as hell with the woeful quality of this box.
It's small & looks good until you turn it on; but on the other side of things, having more and clearer channels is fantastic.

Am totally pessimistic about VAST changing their encryption to allow third party boxes; its more likely that one or two of the other manufacturers will be allowed to develop a 'VAST' box as the current arrangements would be viewed as anti competitive so I suspect this will be the way they will go.

The expansion of FTA TV via VAST, and a much bigger increase of subscribers once the FTA terrestrial blackspot customers come on line, means a whole new beaucratic structure within Conroy's Department to regulate this service.

Beaurocratic behaviour, being what it is, will mean that the boffins are more likely to increase regulation and control around VAST rather than decrease it. On the flip side, they wont have the resources to continually monitor and block decryption techniques and c/s in the way the pay providers have done.

Over to you - tech savvy guys on this forum to continue the good fight!

[autertip]

I dont think its an issue of the box being specially developed by VAST. I think its more likely its an Irdeto licensing issue. It looks like these new kappa cards and above versions require a special version of the licensed CAM.

This seems to be the same issue with all the Kappa card released elsewhere in the world.

[Strada916]

The million dollar questions

So what will happen when other manufacturers release an authorised vast box...

1. Will UEC be forced to somehow unmarry current vast cards, allowing to work within other authorised boxes?

No. The VAST specs quantify a silicon sercure marriage between box and card

2. When other boxes are available, will we be forced again to only buy as a card and box package deal, or will there be a card only option?

Yes you will need to buy another box and card. This is the only way the specs say you can buy one.

3. Will these new authorised boxes be locked down like current UEC is, or could they be used to receive other channels and sats?

From what I have gathered yes they will be locked out. Given they are to conform to a spec

4. If UEC release a PVR box, will current vast cards be unmarried, then remarried and work in new PVR box, or will it require another vast card authorisation?

Another box/card combo will be needed. The cards can not be divorced from the box just like the box can not be divorced from the card

Realise it's a wait and see, as there are no answers yet. I'm like most of us and frustrated as hell with the woeful quality of this box.
It's small & looks good until you turn it on; but on the other side of things, having more and clearer channels is fantastic.

Give it at least 6 months, you'll be supprised who comes to market!

[Strada916]

I dont think its an issue of the box being specially developed by VAST. I think its more likely its an Irdeto licensing issue. It looks like these new kappa cards and above versions require a special version of the licensed CAM.

This seems to be the same issue with all the Kappa card released elsewhere in the world.

wrong. the boxes are especially develped for VAST.

I'll need to see if I can find the specs for all to see.

[Strada916]

these are the minimum apecs

[LeroyPatrol]

these are the minimum apecs

It's only specifying features that have already been deveoped, nothing new.

Leroy

[dstudd]

It's only specifying features that have already been deveoped, nothing new.

Leroy

For those that don't know, here's a link to the VAST Specifications that any third party manufacturer will have to adhere to:

Link:

these are the minimum apecs

Sorry Strada916... I can't read!!

[Tiny]

In the VAST specs there is this:
"• include control word encryption to protect the control word delivery between the smartcard and the paired MPEG chip;
• support a unique identity so that only authorised set top boxes can work in the operator’s network;
• allow secure software over the air downloads into set top box to upgrade security and / or functionality requirements, including middleware;"
Does this mean they have built in the ability to change the encryption for security reasons & therefore prevent thirdparty boxes from working in the longterm, even if some have been working in the past

[gordon_s1942]

In the VAST specs there is this:
"• include control word encryption to protect the control word delivery between the smartcard and the paired MPEG chip;
• support a unique identity so that only authorised set top boxes can work in the operator’s network;
• allow secure software over the air downloads into set top box to upgrade security and / or functionality requirements, including middleware;"
Does this mean they have built in the ability to change the encryption for security reasons & therefore prevent thirdparty boxes from working in the longterm, even if some have been working in the past

Based on that I would believe thats exactly what it says.
ANY and ALL VAST STB's can be authorised or denied service as directed by the Authorising Body.
A couple of years ago a Court Order denied access of the ABC via Aurora into certain areas due to some case before the Courts.
Right from Day One the intention I believe has NEVER been to allow the use of 3rd party receivers and unless there is an absolutely about face, it never will be.
They however have left the back door open by not being more vigilant in ensuring the VAST stb's are where they are supposed to be.

[Strada916]

For those that don't know, here's a link to the VAST Specifications that any third party manufacturer will have to adhere to:

Link:



Sorry Strada916... I can't read!!

not to worry dude, no need for applogy

[wxcooper]

any updates on what the 3rd box may and what is the other box that is supposed to be available beside the UEC.

wxcooper

[Strada916]

Hills and uec are the know manufactures for vast atm

[autertip]

wrong. the boxes are especially develped for VAST.

I'll need to see if I can find the specs for all to see.

Nothing in those specs that have been posted say to me the box was developed for VAST. Its based upon the DVB-S2 standard with the irdeto softcell version 3

for the Conditional Access System:
• support an embedded IRDETO KMS Conditional Access System
consisting of softcell version 3 within the Set Top Box; and
• support IRDETO Smart Card version 5 or higher conforming to ISO7816;

The reason you cannot use the card in any other box is because you need "irdeto softcell 3.0" which off course is licensed by Irdeto.