Pro's and cons of DIY

[8DashP]

Hi all,

I've never Had, seen or used satellite TV before, so please excuse any newbie comments I may make.

We moved to Maryvale, east or Warwick, QLD, from Brisbane 3 years ago. Maryvale is in a TV blackspot, so we have just lived without television since then, surviving on a Bigpond Movies DVD subscription for our entertainment.

For various reasons, mostly to reduce monthly ongoing expenses, we're looking at getting a VAST setup to receive FTA channels. The eligibility site says we are eligible to get it, so the question becomes what's the most economical and doable method?

I've been trying to read up on satellite TV and the VAST service, so I think I now understand the basics, and have some specific questions.

Firstly, we had our house built when we moved out here, and had 2 antenna points wired at time of construction - 1 in the lounge room, and 1 in our bedroom. The coax cable is still sitting in coils in the room, unconnected. I haven't checked, and am not sure what to look for, but I assume it's cheaper rg59 cable that would normally be used for terrestrial antennas, and not rg6, which seems to be recommended for Sat TV. Can we live with the RG59 to avoid rewiring, or will the quality be too poor?

Secondly, our bedroom point is about 12m from the lounge room point. Would splitting the cable to wire both rooms cause much signal loss? Wiring our bedroom is not essential and could be done later. The other option is to try and use and AV sender from the lounge, but there's about 4 walls in the line of site which seems it could be a problem with senders.

Thirdly, I see some suppliers selling VAST self-install kits, from between $550 -$650 depending on their parts list. I priced up the parts individually to match some of these kits and it comes out at around $470 - $500, although all the kit makers offer instructions, which wouldn't come with individual parts purchases. Installation seems fairly straight forward though, isn't it? Basically mount dish and lnbf, lay cable, install wall sockets & plugs, align antenna, plugin & go. Is that correct?

Any cons to DIY? If I have to lay the cable myself, that's a big con as I don't really want to try and crawl around in the roof, dropping cables through the wall, but if I have to replace what I have, maybe I can use the current cable as a tie in to pull the new stuff through?

Quite a few of the kits offer an antenna alignment tool. Are these needed, or can you DIY with homemade stuff?

Fourthly, the dish itself. It should be a KU band solid dish? And minimum size should be 85cm for decent reception? We have a colourbond roof, so a tin roof mount is the best option?

Finally, the STB itself seems as though there's a choice of 1 currently - the UEC which everyone seems to be complaining about. I'd ideally like a PVR option. I've seen some threads that say Altech will offer a firmware PVR patch sometime, but no word yet, and possibilities that other manufacturers may soon be offering other VAST STBs, but "soon" seems to be undefined.

So i realise that's a big list of questions. any answers on any of those questions would be great, to point me in the direction about getting a basic setup for us to watch FTA TV, and anything to watch if I try to DIY with no experience, would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks. Russell.

[beer4life]

Hi all,

I've never Had, seen or used satellite TV before, so please excuse any newbie comments I may make.

We moved to Maryvale, east or Warwick, QLD, from Brisbane 3 years ago. Maryvale is in a TV blackspot, so we have just lived without television since then, surviving on a Bigpond Movies DVD subscription for our entertainment.

For various reasons, mostly to reduce monthly ongoing expenses, we're looking at getting a VAST setup to receive FTA channels. The eligibility site says we are eligible to get it, so the question becomes what's the most economical and doable method?

I've been trying to read up on satellite TV and the VAST service, so I think I now understand the basics, and have some specific questions.

Firstly, we had our house built when we moved out here, and had 2 antenna points wired at time of construction - 1 in the lounge room, and 1 in our bedroom. The coax cable is still sitting in coils in the room, unconnected. I haven't checked, and am not sure what to look for, but I assume it's cheaper rg59 cable that would normally be used for terrestrial antennas, and not rg6, which seems to be recommended for Sat TV. Can we live with the RG59 to avoid rewiring, or will the quality be too poor?

Secondly, our bedroom point is about 12m from the lounge room point. Would splitting the cable to wire both rooms cause much signal loss? Wiring our bedroom is not essential and could be done later. The other option is to try and use and AV sender from the lounge, but there's about 4 walls in the line of site which seems it could be a problem with senders.

Thirdly, I see some suppliers selling VAST self-install kits, from between $550 -$650 depending on their parts list. I priced up the parts individually to match some of these kits and it comes out at around $470 - $500, although all the kit makers offer instructions, which wouldn't come with individual parts purchases. Installation seems fairly straight forward though, isn't it? Basically mount dish and lnbf, lay cable, install wall sockets & plugs, align antenna, plugin & go. Is that correct?

Any cons to DIY? If I have to lay the cable myself, that's a big con as I don't really want to try and crawl around in the roof, dropping cables through the wall, but if I have to replace what I have, maybe I can use the current cable as a tie in to pull the new stuff through?

Quite a few of the kits offer an antenna alignment tool. Are these needed, or can you DIY with homemade stuff?

Fourthly, the dish itself. It should be a KU band solid dish? And minimum size should be 85cm for decent reception? We have a colourbond roof, so a tin roof mount is the best option?

Finally, the STB itself seems as though there's a choice of 1 currently - the UEC which everyone seems to be complaining about. I'd ideally like a PVR option. I've seen some threads that say Altech will offer a firmware PVR patch sometime, but no word yet, and possibilities that other manufacturers may soon be offering other VAST STBs, but "soon" seems to be undefined.

So i realise that's a big list of questions. any answers on any of those questions would be great, to point me in the direction about getting a basic setup for us to watch FTA TV, and anything to watch if I try to DIY with no experience, would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks. Russell.

G'Day Russel,
DIY is not as daunting as it may at first appear.
First consideration is the cable. The type should be printed along the cable itself. Either type should suffice.
It is a little unclear if the cable is actually installed between the various points.
Where it exits to your roof will more or less dictate the type of mount.
If you have a North aspect wall, you could even use a wall mount below the roof line. Height is not a consideration unless you have obstructions, trees, buildings etc.
You could dispense with the meter if you can view the STB display.
Many of the parts are readily available on e-bay at good prices.
If you use a Twin/Dual output 10700 LNB you can have independent connection to both points without Splitters or Multiswitch or Sender and any attendant losses.
85 cm Dish would be ideal.
I would suggest leaving the STB to last, to see if something better comes on the market or whether a 3rd party box will fill the bill.
We're always here if you have any problems or don't understand.

I do hope that this removes any trepidation with your install.

Kindest Regards, " The Druid ".

[zacker]

Hi all,

I've never Had, seen or used satellite TV before, so please excuse any newbie comments I may make.

We moved to Maryvale, east or Warwick, QLD, from Brisbane 3 years ago. Maryvale is in a TV blackspot, so we have just lived without television since then, surviving on a Bigpond Movies DVD subscription for our entertainment.

For various reasons, mostly to reduce monthly ongoing expenses, we're looking at getting a VAST setup to receive FTA channels. The eligibility site says we are eligible to get it, so the question becomes what's the most economical and doable method?

I've been trying to read up on satellite TV and the VAST service, so I think I now understand the basics, and have some specific questions.

Firstly, we had our house built when we moved out here, and had 2 antenna points wired at time of construction - 1 in the lounge room, and 1 in our bedroom. The coax cable is still sitting in coils in the room, unconnected. I haven't checked, and am not sure what to look for, but I assume it's cheaper rg59 cable that would normally be used for terrestrial antennas, and not rg6, which seems to be recommended for Sat TV. Can we live with the RG59 to avoid rewiring, or will the quality be too poor?

Secondly, our bedroom point is about 12m from the lounge room point. Would splitting the cable to wire both rooms cause much signal loss? Wiring our bedroom is not essential and could be done later. The other option is to try and use and AV sender from the lounge, but there's about 4 walls in the line of site which seems it could be a problem with senders.

Thirdly, I see some suppliers selling VAST self-install kits, from between $550 -$650 depending on their parts list. I priced up the parts individually to match some of these kits and it comes out at around $470 - $500, although all the kit makers offer instructions, which wouldn't come with individual parts purchases. Installation seems fairly straight forward though, isn't it? Basically mount dish and lnbf, lay cable, install wall sockets & plugs, align antenna, plugin & go. Is that correct?

Any cons to DIY? If I have to lay the cable myself, that's a big con as I don't really want to try and crawl around in the roof, dropping cables through the wall, but if I have to replace what I have, maybe I can use the current cable as a tie in to pull the new stuff through?

Quite a few of the kits offer an antenna alignment tool. Are these needed, or can you DIY with homemade stuff?

Fourthly, the dish itself. It should be a KU band solid dish? And minimum size should be 85cm for decent reception? We have a colourbond roof, so a tin roof mount is the best option?

Finally, the STB itself seems as though there's a choice of 1 currently - the UEC which everyone seems to be complaining about. I'd ideally like a PVR option. I've seen some threads that say Altech will offer a firmware PVR patch sometime, but no word yet, and possibilities that other manufacturers may soon be offering other VAST STBs, but "soon" seems to be undefined.

So i realise that's a big list of questions. any answers on any of those questions would be great, to point me in the direction about getting a basic setup for us to watch FTA TV, and anything to watch if I try to DIY with no experience, would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks. Russell.

If your house was built 3 years ago, chances are that the cable they installed would be RG6. RG6 is much better for satellite TV due to sat tv being of a much higher frequency to fta tv. However if the existing cabling is RG59, join it to the RG6 you run off the sat and see how you go. I have never tried this but you have nothing to loose.

If you wish to have a setup to view VAST in two rooms, you will unfortunately need two set top boxes unless you use an AV Sender. May I recommend if you do wish to have two VAST boxes that you use a dual lnb rather than a splitter. If you use an approved splitter you will inevitably run into problems, especially if VAST starts using both vertical and horizontal polarity for its broadcasts.

In terms of the equipment you will need I recommend you purchase the following:
Iron Roof Mount
85cm Dish - maybe able to get away with a 65cm but may as well use a 85cm
Dual 10700 LNB
VAST stb
cheap $20 sat finder

Hopefully all goes well mate

[8DashP]

Thanks guys, that's a great help.

Our current antenna point are connected at the wall outlets with standard antenna points and wall plates, but the cable is unconnected in the roof, as we didn't get an actual antenna installed with the house, we just wanted the capacity if we later wanted TV. I think it's just the 2 ends of each cable int he roof. When I can get the ladder out I'll climb up there and check out the cable.

I assume the standard points are not correct. Will I be able to just change over the connectors on my current wall plate, or does it require a whole new plate for the Satellite connectors as well?

We have a clear line of sight in all directions, although not to the horizon on any, as we're on 8 acres in the Great Dividing range foothills. Southeast and Southerly in particular are obscured by about 20 degrees, but NE->W are pretty clear. Not a tree in sight on our block either.

I think I read the UEC STb doesn't have signal strength or anything like that to help calibration, which I why I wondered about the tracker. But if the cheap ones are as good as the expensive, then I don't mind spending an extra $20 if it makes things easier.

Regarding the LNB, happy to get a dual, sounds much better. Is there any difference in the quality? A quick Ebay search has shown one for $24. I'm not sure what effect vertical and horizontal polarity causes, so do I need to look for some spec relating to that, or as long as it says it's a dual or twin, it's fine?

Thanks again for the speedy replies.

Russell.

[viewer]

This may help you aim the dish correctly



Put your address up the top, Select C1/D3 satellite & press GO.

Gives you all the good info.

[beer4life]

A 10700 dual output LNB only has one outlet, STB switchable (18V/14V) for H/V.
A 10700 TWIN/ Dual LNB is more or less two such LNBs in the one unit and independent of each other. Has two output sockets.

[LeroyPatrol]

Jump in the roof and look and see what the cable is. It§s usually written on the side of the cable.
You can change the wall plates they're cheap. You might get a away with getting just the F connetor insert for the wall plates.
I'd look at getting a dual output LNB like this one on ebay:


Cheers,
Leroy

[8DashP]

Thanks for the link viewer, I see they even have an iPhone app - even easier
Those $8 Hong Kong finders on eBay any use? Or does the info on the site do all they can anyway?

Regarding the LNB, I see there's quad ones available too. No use to me currently, but good to have the option later if the kids want to join in, in their rooms. They're all shapes & sizes, but I assume the mount is the same on all of them?

I found a combines wall plate + socket for $4.45 as well, so I guess no argument on that one really.

Ebay dishes are a bit short on supply at 85cm. I see some 80, some 90. Is there really much difference? I note some of the mounting brackets say up to 85cm, so would a 90cm dish not fit in those brackets? Given the size of these 2 items, postage would add up, so i assume if I can find a local supplier pickup, I'm likely to maker a saving, as long as they are price competitive on the dishes.

Amazing how quick this comes together when you get some good info like you guys have provided, so thanks once more. Shame there's no shop-around options for the STB.

I'm keen to pull out that ladder and check my cable now, so I'll go have a look and see what I've got

Russell.

[viewer]

If you have a local recycler, you can often get the lock stock and barrell from there, from those that have disposed of them...a nice cheap option!!

[8DashP]

Jump in the roof and look and see what the cable is. It§s usually written on the side of the cable.
You can change the wall plates they're cheap. You might get a away with getting just the F connetor insert for the wall plates.
I'd look at getting a dual output LNB like this one on ebay:


Cheers,
Leroy

Yep, that's the LNB I was eyeballing

Good news and bad news on the cable front
Good news - it's got RG-6U written on it
Bad news - the short run is long, and the long run is short (plus I popped a nail on the roof sheeting when I mis-stepped - oops!)

If I cut the long one and join it to the short one, any chance I'll experience any issues? Before I go that far though, I'll have to check the dish alignment, but if I put it on the roof where the two cables currently reach, it could be pointing close along the tin roof, which I assume would affect the incoming signal.

I'll keep an eye out for 2nd hand bits, but I don't think Warwick offers a large used parts selection.

[viewer]

What about Toowoomba tip..not too far?? Maybe worth a ring?

[beer4life]

Yep, that's the LNB I was eyeballing

Good news and bad news on the cable front
Good news - it's got RG-6U written on it
Bad news - the short run is long, and the long run is short (plus I popped a nail on the roof sheeting when I mis-stepped - oops!)

If I cut the long one and join it to the short one, any chance I'll experience any issues? Before I go that far though, I'll have to check the dish alignment, but if I put it on the roof where the two cables currently reach, it could be pointing close along the tin roof, which I assume would affect the incoming signal.

I'll keep an eye out for 2nd hand bits, but I don't think Warwick offers a large used parts selection.

Depends how easy to replace the short cable, but to join you would need an additional 2 F6 plugs and a joiner. Might well cost similar.
Mounts max dish size are quoted to allow for wind loading. 85/95 near enough.
Your dish will probably be pointing at an elevation ~62.4 degrees, so pointing along the roof line should not be a problem.
Use roof screws where possible, not nails.

Your Location Satellite Data Dish Setup Data Latitude: -22.9983°
Longitude: 150.5940°

Name: 156E OPTUS C1 | OPTUS D3

Distance: 36413km
Motor Latitude: -23.0°
Declination Angle: 3.9°
Dish Elevation: °
Elevation: 62.4°
Azimuth (true): 13.6°
Azimuth (magn.): 4.2°
LNB Skew [?]: 12.5°


Dish Skew [?]: 90.0°

[Optima Collins]

8DashP, I know I'm jumping the gun bigtime here, but why stop at one satellite? You seem to be realising that sat installations aren't really that difficult and when that happens, the hobby bug bites and then in no time you will find your drive way full of dishes pointing who knows where.

This is just for information purposes and doesn't relate to your earlier request, but it might be useful to know. VAST isn't the only service offering Australian free to air. All of the ABC's and SBS's, i.e. from every state are freely available on the Optus D1 Satellite (to the right of C1). The obvious advantages here are that you don't need a special box to receive these signals, any cheapy from ebay or the local op shop will work. I bought one on gumtree.com.au with an 90cm dish, LNB and mount for $35. The other advantage is that you can use the different time zones to timeshift your viewing. For example, I often watch the 7pm Perth ABC news at 10pm in NSW or if I miss the beginning of the main movie I can switch to South Australia which lags NSW by half an hour. I'm sure you get the idea.

Optus D2 (to the left of C1) has a wide selection of free to air. Although most of it is Christian TV, there are a couple of good news services (Press TV and Russia Today) and NHK World (Japan's English channel).

Then there is C band. You will need an large dish around 2m in diameter, but with your land you can get a JONSA ground mount, like mine and literally plant it anywhere. These are good for such services as Euronews on Asiasat 5 or BBC world and Australia Network (which is a mixture of Australian content from the ABC, SBS and the commercial channels) on both Intelsat 8 and Intelsat 5.




Also, you didn't mention the ages of the kids. My girls range from 4 to 12 so I have given them a dedicated box and TV with the kids programming on all of the ABC channels (Optus D1), Smile of a child and JCTV (Optus d2), and MTV on Intelsat 8 (Ok its the Chinese MTV, but a lot of the content is in English).

Finally, I haven't mentioned all of the FTA sports feeds you might find from time to time and all of the foreign content. Have a look here:

Happy viewing
OC

[viewer]

Now you'll have his mouth watering OC

[Optima Collins]

Now you'll have his mouth watering OC

..... mwhahaha ....

[weirdo]

If you're willing to make a drive to Ipswich I can give you a 70 cm dish and I'll more than likely have a sat box you can have aswell to get you started, time to clean up some stuff I don't use anymore.
PM me if you like

[viewer]

If you're willing to make a drive to Ipswich I can give you a 70 cm dish and I'll more than likely have a sat box you can have aswell to get you started, time to clean up some stuff I don't use anymore.
PM me if you like

Way to go weirdo...terrific of you to help him like this....give yourself a pat on the back.

[8DashP]

[COLOR=Blue]Depends how easy to replace the short cable, but to join you would need an additional 2 F6 plugs and a joiner. Might well cost similar.
Mounts max dish size are quoted to allow for wind loading. 85/95 near enough.
Your dish will probably be pointing at an elevation ~62.4 degrees, so pointing along the roof line should not be a problem.

It's not the cost if the cable in worried about, but the effort to get the old one out and a new one in it's place. Not my cup of tea.

My azimuth setting is 57 degrees, so yeah it's pointing high enough and my direction is -3.2 degrees. My roofline runs about 2 degrees and the cable reaches the east side if the house, so at that licationth dish would be in the middle of the roofline, pointing about 5 degree back across the roof peak, but elevated out of line of sight.

[8DashP]

8DashP, I know I'm jumping the gun bigtime here, but why stop at one satellite?

LOL, you're trying to ge me in trouble with SWMBO aren't you?

I'll look at all the options but don't want to go overboard too much - I have enough hobbies already sucking my resources

[8DashP]

If you're willing to make a drive to Ipswich I can give you a 70 cm dish and I'll more than likely have a sat box you can have aswell to get you started, time to clean up some stuff I don't use anymore.
PM me if you like

Thanks for the generous offer. PM sent