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Thread: Building an alarm

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bet2win View Post
    Thats where your perimeter detection devices come into play.
    I've looked at the possibility of perimeter detection, but what happens then?
    I was even thinking of a loudspeaker with recorded noises that played post perimeter detection - there could be an order of sensors that go off, depending on the order changes where the noises are played / lights switch on or off etc.
    The possibilities are endless for what happens when detecting someone on the property!

    As it's about 30 seconds (1 min tops) from fence to house entry on most properties in the area and a lot of crooks actually watch when owners leave anyway, any ideas on what to do when they are in the house?



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    Perimeter protection can be quite entertaining to say the least IE: having PE beams triggering sprinklers. As for noise etc, if you want to attract attention from neighbours, passers by and deter the crooks, you need something over the top. Something no one's expecting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drift View Post
    Perimeter protection can be quite entertaining to say the least IE: having PE beams triggering sprinklers.
    Hahahahaha that is brilliant! Definitely something they wouldn't be expecting
    I bet you guys have fun coming up with this stuff!!

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    Default Security by design

    While trees and shrubs create some privacy, they are also preferred by many criminals to hide their intentions from neighbours, passer-byes and view in general.



    I'd start by the design of the landscaping, making it more neighbour friendly. After all, if you're relying on a "LOUD" alarm driven by your atmega32 MCU to drive away perps. Then you'd want your neighbours to be able to get a good look at who's leaving the premises.

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    Nothing wrong with atmega32, does the job. You'll probably find similar micros in almost all comercially available alarms.

    Some people like living in a concrete jungle, some the bush. Cheers for the image post, it might clear up the reasoning behind wanting an alarm that impedes a burglar stealing something inside the house.

    Not too keen on cutting down trees, privacy and lifestyle exceed the desire to have a neighbour watch a thief leave. Given that most of the crimes in areas like these are during the day when not even the neighbours are usually home - but you'd know that..

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    Quote Originally Posted by hj1980 View Post
    Not too keen on cutting down trees, privacy and lifestyle exceed the desire to have a neighbour watch a thief leave. Given that most of the crimes in areas like these are during the day when not even the neighbours are usually home - but you'd know that..
    The demographics show 25%* of the population in your neck of the woods is of retirement age. It also shows that 45%* of the population up there is either, unemployed or retired. So chances that a neighbour will see something is quite great.

    *Australian Bureau of Statistics


    Landscaping should be part of your security plan, as you have already highlighted plenty of times in this thread, that alarm systems are pointless in preventing theft.

    1. Untidy, un-kept lawns give the perception that the home is unoccupied, thus increasing the likelihood of becoming a target.
    2. Trees and shrubs around entry/exit points should be trimmed and maintained as to not provide any cover for would-be intruders.
    3. Trees close to the home can be used as ladders to reach second storey windows etc.

    Opportunistic thieves are not going to jimmy a window open in plain sight. Even if they have the perception that no one is home during the day light hours. Statistics show they are more than likely going to invade when you are home.

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    Cheers - I'll take it onboard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hj1980 View Post
    1) We are always at the cutting edge.
    I was referring to my firm, not making a general observation about society. And no, you aren't at the cutting edge, you're learning how to solder a few parts together. Nor are any of your ideas new or clearly thought out.

    Trawl through my historic posts and you'll see I've helped plenty of DIYers and those seeking to try and change things. Some have gone on to develop actual products/services and we are good mates.

    After your rather uncalled for attacks on my motivation, I could respond to your other points but you're probably not interested, nor are you interesting. And given your lack of discretion (not to mention douchebaggery to date) I daresay your professional security career was over before it ever began. Behold, the man who is going to put us all out of business.


    Publicly available imagery from deep within the secure research facility deeeeep in the basement of his parents acreage homestead.


    Attention Chinese copycat manufacturers: Witness the latest Australian technology, the Funway 31337 Securitron with Facebook/LED integration and super-secret ROT-26 Double-XOR EOL crypto. We are on teh internetz monituring ur houzes!


    Sorry mate. Do you really think I see you as a threat to my livelihood? Do you actually believe that was the motivation behind my earlier comments?

    Now listen carefully son, you now have an important decision to make. After my well-aimed spray, you can get petulant and angry and end up digging yourself even deeper into a hole (originally of your own making), or you can pull your head right in and recognise that some of us actually do know what we are talking about. If you're lucky, we might just choose to help you, subject to an attitude realignment. Your call. I'll give you a tip to get you started. Your problem goes beyond technology and back to basic security principles. Refer and absorb my earlier comments. Or don't.
    Last edited by downunderdan; 11-12-11 at 09:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drift View Post
    Perimeter protection can be quite entertaining to say the least IE: having PE beams triggering sprinklers. As for noise etc, if you want to attract attention from neighbours, passers by and deter the crooks, you need something over the top. Something no one's expecting.
    Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.
    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ixgc_FGam3s]Monty Python's Flying Circus - COMPLETE Spanish Inquisition - YouTube[/ame]

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    Dan - Look I'm sorry about getting worked up about it all. I choose to live a pretty open life both in person and on the internet, as demonstrated by my lack of concern with regard to hiding who I am. To me you really did come across as being completely critical and immediately disregarding, but then I probably came across to you as some arrogant freshy with no experience and some ego.

    OK. Consider my head pulled in. I'd much prefer to be in a position where I can benefit from your experiences and learn from you - and others on this forum.

    I'm still going to build my own alarm, because I want to learn from it - but am going to take steps to provide other layers of security as everyone has pointed out.

    Sorry if I've offended and I know that I can take a more respectful attitude going forward. I just hope that there's a mutual respect for me being motivated and wanting to learn for myself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by downunderdan View Post
    ROT-26 Double-XOR EOL crypto
    Nice touch btw

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    Quote Originally Posted by hj1980 View Post
    I'm still going to build my own alarm, because I want to learn from it
    Can I suggest that before you do that, you get a factory-made unit, learn about its programming and installation etc. Pull that sucker apart. That's how many of us learned.

    Right now, you don't know what you don't know. Reverse-engineering someone else's unit will allow you to ask the right questions rather than miss something. A lot of this stuff is very straightforward when it's explained but isn't commonsense. That is, you probably won't figure it out yourself (save for learning the hard way). DIY and hobbying is fine, but there's a very small margin for error when personal safety and security is concerned.
    Last edited by downunderdan; 12-12-11 at 11:01 AM.

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    Can you please recommend a fairly well featured controller that I can pick up cheap as a second or even just old, so I can get my hands grubby?
    Last edited by hj1980; 12-12-11 at 10:36 PM. Reason: chirpy

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    Below is a copy of a notice from the BENS website offering other point of views why monitoring is better than SMS

    SMS and Email Use For Contacting Clients Regarding Alarm Activations etc

    For some time we have been receiving enquiries regarding the use of SMS messaging (and to a lesser extent, email) to advise clients of situations that we have detected regarding their protected premises. One would think we would be in favour of this as it would indeed make us more ‘efficient’.

    There are however issues of exposure/risk which we, you and us as Service Providers, must consider. We must be mindful that whenever any losses occur, all parties will be joined and asked to answer why each, individually or severally, should not be held liable to make good, in part or in full, losses suffered. Insurance firms are famously known to practise such methods of machine-gun-spray diplomacy. It would therefore be prudent to avoid such situations and we should therefore not encourage the probability of its occurrence.

    The current process of contact by voice is a very important (if not the most important) part in the communications of a situation. On contact, we can, to the best of our ability attest that a proper and authorized person has been contacted and we can, to the best of our ability, assess that that person is coherent and of sound mind to understand the situation at hand and where we can then accept instructions on how to proceed.

    Both SMS messaging and email of a situation do not give us any such confirmation that the information has been received in a timely manner or if at all and, just as importantly, if understood.

    It is our considered opinion that we should not provide such a service even if it ‘saves’ us time (/money). We should discourage it. It is best NOT to introduce new risks.

    If, however, the Client does insist, we would require:
    1. The request in writing;
    2. An acknowledgment in writing that the risks has been explained to them;
    3. A statement that we, you and us, will not be held liable for any losses that may occur as a result of the procedures followed per the request; and
    4. An acknowledgment in writing that it has been explained that this request may affect their insurance policies.

    Other Monitoring Centres may choose to provide this service but BENS will not - unless we are given a suitable waiver.

  • #35
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    Whilst I do agree with much of it, it also sounds like a nice way of saying their automation software doesn't support it.

    I take the view that human operators should be concentrating on high-risk alarms, rather than wasting their time dealing with alarms on entry, late-to-close and low-battery situations which can be dealt with one of two ways:

    a) When the operator has no more urgent alarms and gets around to it. This is not a bad approach but customer doesn't always see it that way. An alarm on entry is NOT urgent at all. You know it's false and you know that a keyholder is on the premises. However if the customer gets a call 2-5 minutes later, their first thought is "what if that were a real robbery", oblivious to the fact that their alarm was downgraded the second they entered their PIN. In fact the phone call is really just a courtesy call. Ironically, the better monitoring stations who prioritise calls end up looking bad.

    b) Sending an email or SMS which can be done immediately but requires automation software from this decade.

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