another sooky poor us article from business not wanting to pay staff properly

[bazzy]

I have come across another article that grinds my gears



so in this ACA article they are saying that the younger generation are basically lazy because they are not coming and working for these small manufacturing businesses because they are instead focusing on education to get better wages.

the reason this annoys me so much is because it comes across as tall poppy syndrome.

basically we are in a free market, the way to attract people to the business is with money.

to attack that younger people want to work in corporate Australia either working from home or working in an "air conditioned office" and to say they need to "adjust their expectations" and "not get educated and instead aim lower" is a disgusting message to give to younger generations.

I have a better idea. how about assess the reason as to why people don't want to work in that industry, bets are that they are paying minimum wage, so if they want to attract people to work in those hostile conditions pay them fairly and they will come.

instead what these companies are doing is wanting to pay minimum wage.

I looked up their business and it doesnt even look like they are trying to find tallent

from their website

"
Positions Vacant

STRIPCO has always been a leader in our Industry, offering excellent employment conditions and entitlements to all our employees. We have an extremely low turnover of employees, who usually leave the company due to retirement, or for personal reasons.

INDUSTRIAL SPRAY PAINTER

Fulltime position. If you would like to be considered for this position and you have the experience required, please email, or call us with your details.
INDUSTRIAL SPRAY PAINTER

POWDERCOATER – No positions available.

ADMINISTRATION – No positions currently available

SANDBLASTER – No positions currently available.

FACTORY HAND – No positions currently available

If you have experience in any of the above positions and would like to submit your details at anytime, for when next a position becomes available, please email your details to ask_us@stripco.com.au, or call us on 9792 3488.
"

So i had a quick look on seek. and I was shocked.

(i actually did this while creating this post)

the wages they are offering on seek is actually in some cases below minimum wage of $23 only offering $20 per hour for factory hand.

Why are these companies complaining on national television that they cant get staff while on the other hand clearly not offering to pay people fairly and in some cases offering below minimum wage?

[enf]

Because they can?

[bazzy]

Because they can?

well actually they cant on the count of hiring someone below minimum wage is illegal but sure i guess they can complain

I mean you could say that older generations hog resources and there is no point keeping them alive long term once they start becoming a burden on society but its a bastard thing to say and society would shun it. so why is it acceptable to say that young generations are lazy and entitled because they are seeking higher education and getting higher payed jobs with better conditions.

the ones who are acting entitled are the generations of people complaining that young people are not taking up on their job offers that one only can liken to slavery.

I also just did the math on how hard that would be to live on that wage.

to make this more fair i have picked a housing location further away from sydney where this business owner was located to make the estimate lean more in their favor.

i picked campbelltown

$20/hour working 40 hours a week is $800

so the cheapest single bedroom unit i could find was in the vacinity of $400 per week
so half of the budget blown and we have only just started

cost of water and electricity i have based on my mothers usage being a single old lady.

$300 per quarter in electricity costs is $1200 / 52 is $23
$377
$300 per quarter for water costs is $1200 / 52 is $23
$354
$2700 per year for vehicle onroad costs ($1700 for insurance cover for people under 25 and $1000 for registration) / 52 is $52
$302
$40 in fuel weekly assuming light vehicle usage
$262
$40 train fair based on the $8 adult fair between campbelltown and reversby
$222
$30 for cheap mobile phone plan no handset repayments etc is 360 / 52 is $6.9 rounded up $7
$215
$500 per year for clothing costs (replacing worn out clothes) / 52 is $9.60 but we can round that down to be conservative to $9
$206
$40 per month for the cheapest internet plan i could find is $480 / 52 is $9.20 so make it $9
$197
$100 per week for food (even i couldnt really do that but for the sake of this)
$97

im sure i am forgetting things here and that assumes that there is literally no dept at all to pay. these people would have $97 left at the end of each week. not much to put into savings and lets hope they have no need to go to the doctor or anything happen to them in this labor intensive work or have any social life that is literally just living to work.

[lsemmens]

You forgot taxation. So budget 19c in the dollar over $18000 there goes a large chunk of your wages, let alone if you want to eat.

[Rick]

the younger generation are f@#kin lazy I work in defense, they are more interested in their phones and extended toilet breaks, don't want to listen and learn, and the arseholes are on a good hourly wage, all you here is them whinging "oh I can't be f$%ked all day long, if I had my way i would drive my boot up there arse and sack them. I currently have 2 apprentices under my care training them both, and do have to say I've laid the law down thick with them, and they have been fantastic, if they weren't under my training they would just be another 2 on the lazy band wagon where the world owes them everything.

[bazzy]

You forgot taxation. So budget 19c in the dollar over $18000 there goes a large chunk of your wages, let alone if you want to eat.

Good Point

$20/hour working 40 hours a week is $800 thats 41600 per year.
Tax free threashold is 18200 so that means $23400 of taxable income so thats $4446 tax
so that means $41600 less tax that gives you $37154 net

so now $37154 gives you a weekly pay of $714.50.
so now the budget above

$400 per week for rent
$314.50
$300 per quarter in electricity costs is $1200 / 52 is $23
$291.5
$300 per quarter for water costs is $1200 / 52 is $23
$268.5
$2700 per year for vehicle onroad costs ($1700 for insurance cover for people under 25 and $1000 for registration) / 52 is $52
$216.5
$40 in fuel weekly assuming light vehicle usage
$176.5
$40 train fair based on the $8 adult fair between campbelltown and reversby
$136.5
$30 for cheap mobile phone plan no handset repayments etc is 360 / 52 is $6.9 rounded up $7
$106.5
$500 per year for clothing costs (replacing worn out clothes) / 52 is $9.60 but we can round that down to be conservative to $9
$97.5
$40 per month for the cheapest internet plan i could find is $480 / 52 is $9.20 so make it $9
$57.5
$100 per week for food (even i couldn't really do that but for the sake of this, I just came back from getting groceries for 2 days for 2 people cost me $100)
-$42.5

so you cant even live on this wage.

the younger generation are f@#kin lazy I work in defense, they are more interested in their phones and extended toilet breaks, don't want to listen and learn, and the arseholes are on a good hourly wage, all you here is them whinging "oh I can't be f$%ked all day long, if I had my way i would drive my boot up there arse and sack them. I currently have 2 apprentices under my care training them both, and do have to say I've laid the law down thick with them, and they have been fantastic, if they weren't under my training they would just be another 2 on the lazy band wagon where the world owes them everything.

So Rick... Boomer... Mate... what is this "good wage" you are talking of I have just shown above how these "good" wages are not even enough to live on. so please don't say anything less than $35per hour.

the fact you refer to your employees as "arseholes" and micromanage peoples toilet break really tells me all i need to know of the type of employer you are. if you didn't have such an attitude and approached this generation with respect then perhaps you would have improved engagement. but given that this generation as clearly shown above can barely afford to even live let alone actually accumulate assets i really dont blame them for having a disinterested attitude towards your business. your the one who ends up on top not them.

to be honest i think you have just demonstrated my point on the attitude that im actually talking about.

also remember. the people in this generation are the ones who will be picking your nursing home and looking after you when you cant wipe your backside anymore so keep that in mind and hope you don't get treated with same level of contempt.

[lsemmens]

Rick says he works in Defence, so I would suggest, that it is part of the strategy to ensure that any recruit can survive in a war situation. Discipline can be very harsh to a young'un off the street. If there are bullets flying around their heads, they might be thankful for that "discipline".

[enf]

Rick says he works in Defence, so I would suggest, that it is part of the strategy to ensure that any recruit can survive in a war situation. Discipline can be very harsh to a young'un off the street. If there are bullets flying around their heads, they might be thankful for that "discipline".

These days, if there were bullets flying around their heads the first thing they'd want to do is tell everyone on Faceache....AND post a selfie....

[Rick]

So Rick... Boomer... Mate... what is this "good wage" you are talking of I have just shown above how these "good" wages are not even enough to live on. so please don't say anything less than $35per hour.

the fact you refer to your employees as "arseholes" and micromanage peoples toilet break really tells me all i need to know of the type of employer you are. if you didn't have such an attitude and approached this generation with respect then perhaps you would have improved engagement. but given that this generation as clearly shown above can barely afford to even live let alone actually accumulate assets i really dont blame them for having a disinterested attitude towards your business. your the one who ends up on top not them.

to be honest i think you have just demonstrated my point on the attitude that im actually talking about.

also remember. the people in this generation are the ones who will be picking your nursing home and looking after you when you cant wipe your backside anymore so keep that in mind and hope you don't get treated with same level of contempt.

That would have to be the biggest load of shit ive read yet from you yet!
A first year apprentices @ $27.80 an hour that still live at home is bloody good money and the lower end tradies @ $44.70 an hour is well above award wages! you are a fool to think i micro manage toilet breaks! seriously would you run a business where and be happy with employee's spending close to an hour in there?. FYI I'm not far from retirement age and no-one will be wiping my arse. The problem with this world is people like you snow flaking everything, discipline is a harsh reality and i sure as shit dont mind dishing it out, it certainly didnt harm me in my younger days.

[bazzy]

That would have to be the biggest load of shit ive read yet from you yet!

Really? well im not forcing you to engage.

A first year apprentices @ $27.80 an hour that still live at home is bloody good money and the lower end tradies @ $44.70 an hour is well above award wages!

I clearly gave you the wage it had to exceed in order to be fair. that was $35 per hour. You can call that $#@^^$#!!$ if you like but the reality is that is the minimum that is required now to both pay for all bills and begin saving so as to not be living pay check to pay check and also potentially save the minimum amount required these days to be able to break into the housing market and buy a house. and this needs to be done early because the amount you need to save for a house now could have bought 2 houses outright about 30 - 40 years ago.

you say "A first year apprentices @ $27.80 an hour that still live at home is bloody good money" implying that because they have not been able to move out of their parents house justifies you paying less than they actually need to live in current days is more about you.

$44.70 per hour for a low end traidie is good but an apprentice wont see that in my understanding for many years and in the case of some businesses they will let them go once the apprenticeship is done so they can hire another apprentice at the cheaper wage. this was done all the time when i went to school i remember people complaining about it.

you are a fool to think i micro manage toilet breaks! seriously would you run a business where and be happy with employee's spending close to an hour in there?.

you litterally indicated in your comment that you do where you said

they are more interested in their phones and extended toilet breaks,

So i am interested to know. in the other generations where smoking was the "cool" thing and a large percentage of the workforce would take smoking breaks every hour or so, did you have the same objection to these people tools down to go and take a smoking break? to be honest that annoys me more that someone going to the toilet. Im not that petty that someone going to the toilet would bother me unless they returned with #@% stains all over their clothing and stunk like they had been swimming in the sewer wanting to shake my hand.

FYI I'm not far from retirement age and no-one will be wiping my arse.

Yes i figured you where that age hence why i said boomer, but do you plan to die before you go into a home? How do you plan to achieve that? my understanding is that doctors will only offer euthanasia if there is a sound medical condition to warrant it and you would also h and old age doesn't count. so i am interested in how you plan to avoid the inevitable?

The problem with this world is people like you snow flaking everything, discipline is a harsh reality and i sure as shit don't mind dishing it out, it certainly didn't harm me in my younger days.

no the problem is the attitude of your generation towards the younger generations. this attitude of "the way we did it was best conform to our way of thinking or we call you names and poke fun at your expense" the reality is the generations after you will do things differently to the way you do things. science has advanced and the psychological field has determined that kicking people to the gutter when you cut wood to short is the improper approach.

society has moved on from those days. for the record I would put money on it that generations before yours did things differently too. additionally just because you had it hard when you where younger doesn't mean you have to make life difficult for those that come after you.

by the way im not a snow flake I just speak up when i see injustice, I have a very strong moral back bone and I really cant stand the attitude from a number of members of your generation.
I mean someone of your generation berated one of my friends who was simply doing his job with a whole lot of negative toxic comments that are extremely unacceptable when all he was doing was getting paperwork for the care package signed. things like your hair is too long, how dare you come dressed like that. (he was wearing smart business casual as per the company policy) to put it bluntly if i was in that situation i would have simply left and dropped that individual as a client. (who by the way no one else would work with) my friend instead was able to get it done. that's the toxic bs i will not stand. he was from this so called lazy generation Z (Im not Gen Z by the way im from the generation stuck between the two generations having the turf war and again quiet bluntly im sick of it)

you need to understand that people speaking out against toxic behavior in the workplace are not "snow flakes"

These days, if there were bullets flying around their heads the first thing they'd want to do is tell everyone on Faceache....AND post a selfie....

enf the problem you really have to worry about is when you raise a generation that will never be able to own their own homes or meaningful assets what incentive do they have to even go to war? what are they protecting? they have nothing as it is now, cant even afford to live in some cases. so they would be going to war putting their life on the line to protect other peoples way of life. you will probably have few people enlisting to fight.

[wotnot]

All of this is about '' from the get go, so quoting the minimum wage is only applicable to adults... for the rest;

• under 16 years of age: 36.8% of national minimum wage = lowest hourly rate of $8.55
• 16 years of age: 47.3% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $10.99
• 17 years of age: 57.8% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $13.43
• 18 years of age: 68.3% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $15.87
• 19 years of age: 82.5% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $19.16
• 20 years of age: 97.7% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $22.70

Due to ADA policies as of 2004 or so, you cannot discriminate by age when advertising a position....

You can however advertise the hourly pay rate, for the position being offered. Optionally you might advertise the job as being a 'junior' position, in which case the above rates apply up until you're 18yo.

If you're offering $20/hr, you've got the under 16 to 19yo bracket covered, and anyone in that age group might qualify for the job.

Another thing is, a lot of the positions that are advertised online, are 'faux positions'...they don't actually exist... gets blamed on 'stale listing', happens all the time...

[bazzy]

All of this is about '' from the get go, so quoting the minimum wage is only applicable to adults... for the rest;

• under 16 years of age: 36.8% of national minimum wage = lowest hourly rate of $8.55
• 16 years of age: 47.3% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $10.99
• 17 years of age: 57.8% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $13.43
• 18 years of age: 68.3% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $15.87
• 19 years of age: 82.5% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $19.16
• 20 years of age: 97.7% of national minimum wage = minimum hourly rate of $22.70

Hay Wotnot can you link where you got that list from as i cant find any official government source for it.

legally speaking you become an adult at the age of 18. I know I moved out of home at 18, so from the age of 18 you shouldn't be being paid any less than minimum wage as that is the age a lot of people have to fend for themselves and be able to make enough to live on.

also at the time of posting gen Z is age 12 – 27 so from working age there is more opportunity from that generation range to be above 20 than below 20.

[Rick]

Really? well im not forcing you to engage.




I clearly gave you the wage it had to exceed in order to be fair. that was $35 per hour. You can call that $#@^^$#!!$ if you like but the reality is that is the minimum that is required now to both pay for all bills and begin saving so as to not be living pay check to pay check and also potentially save the minimum amount required these days to be able to break into the housing market and buy a house. and this needs to be done early because the amount you need to save for a house now could have bought 2 houses outright about 30 - 40 years ago.

you say "A first year apprentices @ $27.80 an hour that still live at home is bloody good money" implying that because they have not been able to move out of their parents house justifies you paying less than they actually need to live in current days is more about you.

$44.70 per hour for a low end traidie is good but an apprentice wont see that in my understanding for many years and in the case of some businesses they will let them go once the apprenticeship is done so they can hire another apprentice at the cheaper wage. this was done all the time when i went to school i remember people complaining about it.




you litterally indicated in your comment that you do where you said So i am interested to know. in the other generations where smoking was the "cool" thing and a large percentage of the workforce would take smoking breaks every hour or so, did you have the same objection to these people tools down to go and take a smoking break? to be honest that annoys me more that someone going to the toilet. Im not that petty that someone going to the toilet would bother me unless they returned with #@% stains all over their clothing and stunk like they had been swimming in the sewer wanting to shake my hand.




Yes i figured you where that age hence why i said boomer, but do you plan to die before you go into a home? How do you plan to achieve that? my understanding is that doctors will only offer euthanasia if there is a sound medical condition to warrant it and you would also h and old age doesn't count. so i am interested in how you plan to avoid the inevitable?


no the problem is the attitude of your generation towards the younger generations. this attitude of "the way we did it was best conform to our way of thinking or we call you names and poke fun at your expense" the reality is the generations after you will do things differently to the way you do things. science has advanced and the psychological field has determined that kicking people to the gutter when you cut wood to short is the improper approach.

society has moved on from those days. for the record I would put money on it that generations before yours did things differently too. additionally just because you had it hard when you where younger doesn't mean you have to make life difficult for those that come after you.

by the way im not a snow flake I just speak up when i see injustice, I have a very strong moral back bone and I really cant stand the attitude from a number of members of your generation.
I mean someone of your generation berated one of my friends who was simply doing his job with a whole lot of negative toxic comments that are extremely unacceptable when all he was doing was getting paperwork for the care package signed. things like your hair is too long, how dare you come dressed like that. (he was wearing smart business casual as per the company policy) to put it bluntly if i was in that situation i would have simply left and dropped that individual as a client. (who by the way no one else would work with) my friend instead was able to get it done. that's the toxic bs i will not stand. he was from this so called lazy generation Z (Im not Gen Z by the way im from the generation stuck between the two generations having the turf war and again quiet bluntly im sick of it)

you need to understand that people speaking out against toxic behavior in the workplace are not "snow flakes"


enf the problem you really have to worry about is when you raise a generation that will never be able to own their own homes or meaningful assets what incentive do they have to even go to war? what are they protecting? they have nothing as it is now, cant even afford to live in some cases. so they would be going to war putting their life on the line to protect other peoples way of life. you will probably have few people enlisting to fight.

you are clearly delusional and live in some kind of fantasy world! you have your opinions and I have mine, and I cant be arsed reading and replying to the garbage you post anymore!

[Al Bundy]

[bazzy]

you are clearly delusional and live in some kind of fantasy world!

ROFL I'm in a fantasy world? i'm not the one that said I won't get old enough to be in a home and be looked after by nurses. you said that here

FYI I'm not far from retirement age and no-one will be wiping my arse

that garbage is your words not mine.

my fantasy world is called reality. the one who is in a fantasy world sadly is you. your out of touch. likely because as you say

FYI I'm not far from retirement

likely completely paid of you house and assets have everything you need in life have a considerable nest egg in the bank and and as such out of touch with the true costs of living means when just starting out and your literally being paid less than what it costs to stay alive meaning this generation has no choice but to live with their parents until mid 20s. instead as you have again clearly said in your words

discipline is a harsh reality and i sure as shit don't mind dishing it out

so using young peoples disadvantaged situation and fear of loosing their jobs to treat people like garbage and thus prooving my point above where said

to be honest i think you have just demonstrated my point on the attitude that im actually talking about.

and this is treatment that if you tried that on with someone my age who is established would likely see your nose broken.

you have your opinions and I have mine, and I cant be arsed reading and replying to the garbage you post anymore!

Im glad, we can agree to disagree here. your comments have gone a lot further to prove my point that i ever could. I have put you on my ignore list so i don't have to see your opinions anymore.

thank you. But this now raises additional concerns. I can understand where it is saying about being in training it is written that way to cover apprenticeships etc but why should people between the age of 18 and 20 be paid less than minimum wage? there not entitled to any concessions and the cost of housing and electricity is the same for them than anyone and in fact as far as age is concerned things like insurance are actually more expensive for younger people.

I mean we pay these young people below minimum wage meaning without any luxuries at all and just paying for the bare minimum is above their means then comment on how they are in so much dept