Reply With Quoteaircell insulation is what you need. R rating of 75mm blanket in a 10mm thick product. Some creative cutting (it cuts with scissors) and aluminium tape and you'll have a nice cosy cover
It's not cheap though. About $260 for a 30m2 roll
Cheers.
Do you have a HWS outside shivering in the Cold.
Only weeks ago I spend a little money and effort and I decided to insulate our Solar Hot water coppers pipes in the roof
as the temperature of the hot water leaving the Solar Panels to the tank hot water input itself was losing around 8 to 9 degrees but after insulating the pipes it now only loses around 4 to 5 degrees so that is good enough for me being worth the effort of insulating the pipes but now for the first time I have noticed a new problem and that is the outside HWS tank yep the 340 L of it is losing temperature quicker that what time it took to sink the titanic. I can actually sit in the Lounge room and watch the Temperature drop dramatically (around 4 hrs) on my Hot water monitoring system so what did I do to stop this? I got out every damm thick old used for working on cars blankets, quilts, old sleeping bags and I covered/rapped the entire tank and what a difference it made.
I surprised that someone doesn't make (haven't had a look yet) a specially made insulated cover that neatly goes over the HWS
Notice the Frost LED, it actuates below 5 degrees, it has been actuated once so far this year for the first time since the Sydney days. Now I was losing tank Temperature long before the Frost circuit decides to work circulating a little hot water around the system to stop the panels freezing up.
Some one needs to make then I will buy a cover that drops over the tank and it must be water proof with an good insulating material inside at least 75MM thick. If this cannot be purchased I have say another 10 months to come up with something that is effective and it looks good.
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aircell insulation is what you need. R rating of 75mm blanket in a 10mm thick product. Some creative cutting (it cuts with scissors) and aluminium tape and you'll have a nice cosy cover
It's not cheap though. About $260 for a 30m2 roll
Cheers.
When I was a kid, I used to have an imaginary friend. I thought he went everywhere with me. I could talk to him and he could hear me, and he could grant me wishes and stuff too. But then I grew up, and stopped going to church.
Could you build an insulated structure around your HWS?
Last edited by ol' boy; 14-07-15 at 12:49 PM.
If u want to go on an expedition get a Land Rover, if u want to come home from an expedition get a Landcruiser!
I have an outside loo along with a handbasin and generally during winter I turn the H/Basin stopcock off to prevent it freezing but 18 months ago during a Tip run, I scavenged a couple of those foam floaty things and split them open and pushed them over the pipes.
One was a bit loose so I used some el cheapo cable ties to keep them in place.
Last week we went down to MINUS 9C and there was a 50 mm icicle hanging out of the tap in the morning as I forgot to turn the stopcock off but because I have covered the pipes, it didnt 'Pop' the expansion joint as it has done when it was uncovered.
It amuses me every winter to read after a good frost of pipes bursting and the Plumbers rubbing their hands raking in the money when its so easy to 'Lag' the pipes at so little cost to prevent the problem.
'Lagging' wont always stop the water freezing in a pipe but it reduces the possibility of it bursting and making a hell of a mess if its in a ceiling or wall cavity.
PS, You can often buy those for around $2 each from the 'junk shops' and most are about 1.5 metres long.
I would prefer the dearer insulation if it was outside and in the direct Sun but otherwise this stuff works ok for me.
BTW, if I was building or renovating a house, there is no way I would route any water lines through the ceiling cavity like that as its asking for trouble and not lagging them is plain bad lazy workmanship by the builder/plumber.
Last edited by gordon_s1942; 14-07-15 at 01:05 PM.
I stand unequivicably behind everything I say, I just dont ever remember saying it !!
Originally Posted by gordon_s1942
The 1/2 inch copper pipes in the roof from panels to HWS are from a complete roll but a crap weak pipe if super cold could burst just outside the roof but away from the warmth of the tank, The complete copper pipe has no joints but its been dam cold the last few days and I would have to say it would have to get -20 outside before the pipes would freeze as if you look at this picture I have a monitor monitoring the Temperature of the pipe, Yes for an old fart I do come up with some new and good ideas as this plus the Electronic panel designed and made by the old fart works very well and surprisingly is very reliable.. Again if the solar panels get below 5 Degrees the Pump on the HWS starts and circulates a limited amount of hot water through the complete system.
/
I could but it must not be ugly. It would be good to have something like a thick insulated waterproof leather Jacket around it with batts inside it. We have a good Sowing machine and could come up with something in the near future.
Will have to look into it and all other options.aircell insulation is what you need. R rating of 75mm blanket in a 10mm thick product. Some creative cutting (it cuts with scissors) and aluminium tape and you'll have a nice cosy cover
It's not cheap though. About $260 for a 30m2 roll
Cheers.
I have found, its not "Heat Loss" from having a HWS installed outside that is main issue, its the temperature differential between the tank and external skin that causes a lot of condensation to form and run inside the HWS outer skin, which causes them to rust out prematurely around the bottom or around the element port.
I've replaced many HWS's that live outside, i've replaced maybe 2 HWS's that live inside.
Water quality also has a lot to do with it.
Build an attractive outbuilding over your HWS that includes some storage, as it will now remain a dry and warmish place.
Last edited by ol' boy; 14-07-15 at 04:45 PM.
If u want to go on an expedition get a Land Rover, if u want to come home from an expedition get a Landcruiser!
This is the big problem with them. When I pored the concrete for the HWS to sit on beside making the concrete red (like other concrete around the House) I use 25MM conduit and made conduit impression in the curing concrete so once dry the HWS sits on the sharp high spot on the corrugation thus allowing all the moisture to drain away, I have checked inside the connection box and other for any evidence of rust but all is ok.
My next Job for the HWS is to replace the Sacrifice anode. Now F.@#k moving the HWS as the electrode is over 1.2M long and will hit the ceiling to remove it, I will either use original, drill a 50MM hole in Fibro overhang above and remove it or cut the old one (cant cut the new one) or I will buy one of those Sausage ones that go into the tank like a snake, LoL
A friend built a house in Blackheath NSW some years ago now and while away for a few days the pipes burst in the ceiling and caused extensive damage.
When this happened, the house was barely 2 years old and it hadnt been that cold as it can do in that area.
I saw a less than 6 months old LPG HWS externally mounted catch fire one fairly windy day when the pilot light managed to ignite the plastic parts.
To stop the LPG regulator on the tank outside, I have wrapped old rag around it for insulation and some plastic to keep the rag dry and I dont care what it looks like so long as it works.
Its a known fact you never stand timber on cement because it can 'wick up' moisture and cause the wood to rot so if I was installing a metal cased HWS on a cement pad, I would be looking for something to go in between it and the tank bottom, a piece of Marine Ply painted maybe?
I stand unequivicably behind everything I say
Rheem used to recommend placing 5 bits of decking between a HWS and Concrete slab to allow for airflow and prevent the collection of moisture.
I've always done it this way, and its outlasted any unit positioned directing on concrete.
Slats can easily been swapped out, if need be, by gently rocking the unit to one side, then the other.
I see now, they have changed the coating and now allow direct contact between HWS and Concrete.
Last edited by ol' boy; 14-07-15 at 08:26 PM.
If u want to go on an expedition get a Land Rover, if u want to come home from an expedition get a Landcruiser!
Those who can remember seeing those Galvanised water tanks of years ago would have seen they were generally placed on slats, never directly on the ground or concrete for that very reason.
Oceanboy, doesnt it amaze you to see its only taken them 50 plus years and god knows how many rusted out bases to do something about the coating on it??
Still, if I was installing one today, bugger their claims of 'How Good it is' and go with a material of some sort to separate the two.
You said about 'Planks', what about these synthetic recycled plastic ones they use now on veranda's etc?.
Last edited by gordon_s1942; 15-07-15 at 02:16 PM.
I stand unequivicably behind everything I say
Yep, they would be good Gordon.
Honestly, i haven't seen the decking rot under a HWS, its always been in good condition.
Standard practice for us has always been a 600mm Square Slab and 6 bits of decking evenly spaced.
If inside or under a house, i'll also use a Gal Hot Water Tray.
As for replacing the Anodes, I've replaced a few, but i'd say 99% of them never get changed.
If u want to go on an expedition get a Land Rover, if u want to come home from an expedition get a Landcruiser!
I did a quick Google but couldn't find any pics
I saw a hws tank resting on a plastic purpose made layer of plastic
a bit like a plastic crate but then only about 20 mm thick
in the past I've always done the same as oceanboy, hardwood slats
It's common building practice now that even galvanized steel posts need to be blackjacked where they touch any concrete/air mixture
we always paint a band of blackjack around ground level
cement will attack the gal over time
Correct as the local Plumbers shop has sold thousands of HWS including Rheem Solar where I got mine from and he tells me this week that that in 18 years he has been in business he is lucky to sell ten a year and that includes to the Plumbing Contractors. It shows you how poorly educated most are today but at the same time its good to see guys that have electrical hobbies and other like sat stuff knowing about that dreaded Anode.
Are you talking about that Bitumen paint?
yes
That paint is a form of bitumen and used to be applied inside your gutters and on the bottom of the galvanised tanks before being installed.
You could also use it when 'patching' an old leaky tank if you could inside it.
I wonder if that one is still available or been replaced by a synthetic type as bitumen is considered to be a carcinogenic risk these days.
I once used it to paint the interior floor of my Austin A40 many moons ago after using Fish Oil to treat the rust.
Back then the Fish Oil had to be painted over or the rust would just re-occur a few weeks.
I stand unequivicably behind everything I say
You can still get the proper bitumen paint, Ormonoid is one brand.
Apparently Polyurethane membrane is suitable for potable water, ie. inside rain water tanks
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