Preferred GPRS

[Pyro]

We are deciding on what unit to standardise on, the Multicom MC4
and Permaconn PM45 seem reliable and both have good Apps.

Is anyone out there using those UHS/ Telstra Secure units?

Any other units I should be investigating?

P.S if anyone else is having Time/Date resets on older Bosch gear with a GPRS hit me up, I've worked out what's going on.

[jk86]

I like the PM45 especially the App and the fact you can remotely dial in through the unit without a phone line. It would be good if it still had the option of a phone line back up but that's not to bad I guess, another good thing is the end user app being able to arm and disarm remotely, it's pretty handy for clients when they get a call saying the staff haven't armed the system.

I've used the direct wireless DTU units and they aren't to bad either but as far as I know there is no app or software, the unit can be remotely switched to PSTN for remote access.

[techy21]

I used direct wireless,UHS telestra lite,and peracom.the peracom unit best by far.good tech support when installation,app to check unit,small easy installation fit inside most panels....

[IRFlunkey]

Have a look, too at Inner Range's Multipath IP units, particularly the newer T4000.
Dialler capture, remote programming / upload-download.

But whichever you choose, be aware that not all monitoring centres support all GPRS communicators, and make sure you don't buy a 2G one (2G gets turned off next year but some companies are still trying to flog 2G gear).

Cheers,
Flunkey

[downunderdan]

the peracom unit best by far.good tech support when installation

Permaconn.

FFS...

I happen to know tech support (from all of the vendors) *hate* when so-called installers ring who clearly haven't even read the manual, have no idea how to wire a connection, and are charging a customer by the hour and wasting tech-support's time to learn how to do something they're claiming to be proficient in.

It will end in tears. I weep for the poor customer who has no idea what they've done.

It's chuckleheads like that who keep me on hold when I need to ring up with a confirmed firmware issue or signalling protocol matter.

[Adro]

We are deciding on what unit to standardise on, the Multicom MC4
and Permaconn PM45 seem reliable and both have good Apps.

Is anyone out there using those UHS/ Telstra Secure units?

Stay away from Telstra Secure. The network is so unreliable. Network falls over on a regular basis. Just recently (6 months or so ago) there was an outage which resulted in hundreds of units stop polling/reporting. When the network did come back up techs were required to attend numerous different sites across the country to power cycle the units. We did manage to get Telstra Secure to pay a few of the tech attendance costs but a few of our bureaus were not so lucky.

Had a small outage in QLD again this week - 8 or so units stopped polling at the same time. They were down for about 3-4 hours and all bar one came back up on there own. Bureau had to attend his site at 5pm to power cycle unit.

Stick with Permaconn, simple plug & play and you never experience the mentioned problems above with Permaconn.

[downunderdan]

We support a number of these systems, so I don't believe I have a 'dog in this fight' and can be reasonably objective.

1) Fundamentally, they all tend to do the same thing. Bells and whistles vary somewhat.

While each vendor tends to slag off the others (some more than others), I tend to sit on the sidelines eating popcorn while I watch them duke it out. Interestingly there is one vendor they ALL tend to agree is dodgey.

2) All networks have outages. Securitel did, everything else which followed did, and does from time to time. Sometimes this is because of the security provider, e.g. their datacentre has a planned/unplanned outage, or it's the network e.g. Telstra/Optus/Vodafone.

No matter how much contingency planning you do, you cannot eliminate risk. There is a reason Qantas have stopped banging on about their safety record. Outages can happen and will happen.
3) Some providers are quite transparent and honest about their outages. I do not believe it is fair that they are punished for this, or their reputation affected. Especially if they handle it and accept responsibility for any loss. Particularly as I note there are other providers which have, as I understand, gone out of their way to cover up such outages and apparently never had one, in years. Yeah right.

I would be far more inclined to trust any supplier who acknowledges that 'shit happens', than any who insist they are perfect, untouchable etc.

I'm also aware (and this thread would certainly demonstrate it) that there are shithouse installers out there who do a terrible job of installation and then when the system fails, it's everybody else's fault. Whether it's signal strength issues, 'phone line fault' issues (e.g. the cable between the panel and the communicator) or similar. Whilst these devices are designed to be 'easy' to install I would not say ANY of them are any more 'plug and play' than any other part of an alarm system, and clearly some people haven't read the manual and/or weren't being closely enforced by a monitoring company before they departed site.

Then there is the case when the monitoring centre hasn't invested in suitable redundancy e.g. running single receivers or a single point of failure internet connection. This happens more often than you'd think due to the 'smoke and mirrors' monitoring companies and their bureau partners tend to produce. And of course when it all goes down, the monitoring centre doesn't put their hand up and the bureau runs around trashing the manufacturer/network provider who meanwhile has been telling the monitoring company for years to get their act together.

The best technology poorly specced and installed is still no good. Polished turds and all that.

Regrettably there are some perfectly respectable vendors whose reputations have been affected because their equipment was not installed or monitored according to manufacturer guidelines that would have avoided the problem.

[Pyro]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the Permaconn App stays in sync with the panels status(arm/disarm) which is quite clever. The multicom doesn't know if somebody has disarmed by the keypad so you need to look at the history.

Dan I think a lot of the problem with 'shithouse installers' stems from employers who don't care.
For many of them it's purely a numbers game. Quantity over quality. I can't tell you the number of times I've seen systems upgraded to GPRS/Safecom and half the detectors are hanging off the wall or they are 25 years old and totally disfunctional but the customer sleeps better knowing they have 'redundancy'. In this case the the latest and greatest GPRS with '99.9% uptime'' is renderred useless.

[downunderdan]

Dan I think a lot of the problem with 'shithouse installers' stems from employers who don't care.

Perhaps, however plenty of them are self-employed and should probably contemplate a change of career.

I can't tell you the number of times I've seen systems upgraded to GPRS/Safecom and half the detectors are hanging off the wall or they are 25 years old and totally disfunctional but the customer sleeps better knowing they have 'redundancy'.

Yes. It's all fun and games until the insurers and lawyers get involved. Then there will be a queue of expert witnesses able to tear you a new one.

[Pyro]

Multicom units are on a contract, typically for three years. Makes a takeover complicated. Do the Permaconns do the same?

[Adro]

Multicom units are on a contract, typically for three years. Makes a takeover complicated. Do the Permaconns do the same?

No Contracts with Permaconn. However There is a $29.95 transfer fee when "Taking one over"

[romaqld]

Adro, never had a transfer fee dropped on me to take one over, maybe that is just pat of doing business for my monitoring centre or maybe isn't one from Radio Data Comms, so not sure on that issue.

downunderdan, I'm with you, only ever called RDC once with a PM1030 that refused to come online even with full resets etc. End result was for some reason the Optus circuit in the country town was dodgy to say the least and for whatever reason they could see the Telstra registration but not Optus.

I have to say I love the PM45's, love the dialer software and ability as well as the 3 outputs, they get put to plenty of use with keyswitch arm/disarm and even random things for driving relays for lights, locks and even roller doors. Customers love the app and control it gives them some even forgoing the remote keyfob for wireless alarms in preference to the app.

[Adro]

Adro, never had a transfer fee dropped on me to take one over, maybe that is just pat of doing business for my monitoring centre or maybe isn't one from Radio Data Comms, so not sure on that issue.

We have never been slugged with it either. But it is there, if you use atlas and have a master account for your company, if you go to the transfer tab you can see the transfer fee. For big companies that primarily pump out the Permaconn units they will waive it. We generally order 50-100 units at a time and have never had to pay the transfer fee. I know small Bureaus who have 3-4 units online that have been hit with it.

[Pyro]

Lot of support for Permaconn.....

Interestingly it monitors the return pair through the dialler, not just the centre two. I learnt that after somebody handed me one to install minus all the fittings.

Has anybody heard an actual termination date for Telstras 2G Network?, and when they do that is it across the board or done in stages as infrastructure is upgraded?

[PANDATECH]

They announced the date as the end of 2016 and Optus have announced mid 2017.

[downunderdan]

We have never been slugged with it either. But it is there, if you use atlas and have a master account for your company, if you go to the transfer tab you can see the transfer fee. For big companies that primarily pump out the Permaconn units they will waive it. We generally order 50-100 units at a time and have never had to pay the transfer fee. I know small Bureaus who have 3-4 units online that have been hit with it.

My understanding is it covers (reasonably in my opinion) RDC's administration in adjudicating a potential shitfight between two bureaus, ownership of the hardware etc.

I'm aware of at least one so-called security provider in NSW who sold their electronic security business to a multinational and then several months later were rebirthed (via a cousin etc.). They then decided to poach all the customers back and ultimately asked the IP Monitoring providers if they would simply switch them all over. Needless to say it was pretty obvious what they were doing and it stank, but it shows the type of malevolence companies like RDC would want to stay well clear of.

[intelliGEORGE]

The only bugbear I have with the Permaconn is the lack of serial interface on the PM45. Nothing worse than installing a lightening fast communicator which is throttled at the dialer capture. Sure you can go the 1030, but then you lack the crucial selling point of remote upload/download.